Ordered a gun

[CanAm500]

Dad just ordered another shotgun. This one is coming from Wholesports in Calgary. We were trap shooting and me and my dad both decided that we do alot beter with the 12 gauge then the 20 gauge (no big surprise).

We decided on the Mossberg 835 in 12 gauge. This is going to be out primary hunting shotgun, as the one before was a 20 gauge nova pump (benilli). So hopefully it will be in Friday

[REDGREEN]

Good idea on the 12 guage. Never had much use for a 20 guage after seeing its performance on a couple of hares by our henhouse years ago. 12 guage would have stopped them now. They went under it.

[PGKris]

How does a 20 ga. do for grouse and/or ducks? I'm flip flopping between getting the .410 or the 20 ga in 870 wingmaster. I know it's big enough for grouse but if I switch to a 30" barrel and shoot 3" shells will I have enough juice for ducks?

[Marc]

You'd be better off with a 12 gauge for ducks. With the introduction of steel shot you pretty much have to go to bigger size shot in steel. In my opinion it just doesn't have enough range and penetration for ducks. The 20 gauge is a great grouse/hare gun but very limited for ducks if you plan on using steel shot.

[PGKris]

Enough range? Even with the 30" barrel? I'm not much of a duck hunter anyway. Love my chickens though.

[guntech]

There is no difference between a 12 and 20 gauge in how far they shoot (if all other things being equal) ....

The difference is it is easier to hit with 12 gauge pattern. It has a better shot string and spread. It does not hit any harder or shoot farther. It does kill better in the hands of most shooters.

[Marc]

There is no difference between a 12 and 20 gauge in how far they shoot (if all other things being equal) ....

The difference is it is easier to hit with 12 gauge pattern. It has a better shot string and spread. It does not hit any harder or shoot farther. It does kill better in the hands of most shooters.

What I was getting at guntech is in order to penetrate and kill with Steel shot you have to speed it up and increase the pellet size. In order to speed things up there has to be a give and take. If you speed it up you have to go with a lighter payload(less shot) The 20 gauge just doesn't have the payload capasity if you're speeding it up compared to a 12 gauge. To hunt with Steel shot they use thicker wads to protect the barrel decreasing the payload area as well.

Like I said before the 20 gauge is a nice upland game shotgun but I'd never buy one for the purpose of hunting ducks and geese unless you're willing to pay big coin to use "bismouth" or "heavy shot" lead alternatives and trust me they are pricy costing anywhere from $1 to $6 per shell depending where you buy them.

Marc.

[CanAm500]

The difference is it is easier to hit with 12 gauge pattern. It has a better shot string and spread. It does not hit any harder or shoot farther. It does kill better in the hands of most shooters.

That is very true. If you try trap shooting with a 20 gauge it is harder to hit the clays, even at 16 yards.

But on the other hand, like Marc said the 20 gauge is a excellent shotgun for grouse hunting.

[PGKris]

So the 20 is great for grouse (little overkill IMO) but if I can shoot it well enough I can do ducks? I can shoot. Don't worry bout that.

[Marc]

A 20 gauge is a great grouse gun on the wing in my opinion. As far as hunting ducks it has nothing to do with you not being a good shot it's more to do with putting enough pellets into the bird. Steel shot #2 and bigger just doesn't patter very well out of the 20 gauge and the pellet count in my opinion is just to low. Plus steel shot for the 20 gauges is most times more expensive then it is for a 12 gauge.

Here is an example between a 20 gauge compared to a 12 gauge. The fastest load I could find with the 20 gauges was 1350 fps. With a payload of 7/8 oz of shot. That's a 3-inch shell. If you compare it to a 12-gauge 3-inch shell I can launch one at 1475 fps with a 1 1/4 oz payload. Speed kills with steel shot because it's so much lighter then lead. Here is the pellet count difference for let’s say #2 shot that I think is the ideal size for ducks. You have to realize that a # 2 pellet doing 1400 fps out of the muzzle only has 15.2 ft-lbs of energy. When that pellet reaches 30 yards it’s only got 4.7 ft-lbs of energy.

20 gauge 3 inch 7/8 oz = 108 pellets 1350 fps
12 gauge 3 inch 1 1/4 oz = 156 pellets 1475 fps

That gives the 12 gauge another 48 pellets over the 20 gauge and another 125 fps faster. There is a lot faster loads with the 12 gauge if you drop the payload down but you still need a good pattern to kill ducks constantly.

If your planning on hunting Geese lets take a look at BB shot size.

20 gauge 3 inch 7/8 oz = 62 pellets 1350 fps
12 gauge 3 inch 1 1/4 oz = 87 pellets 1475 fps

Again the 12 gauge is traveling another 125 fps faster and has a pellet advantage of 25 more pellets. You have to realize that a BB pellet doing 1400 fps out of the muzzle has around 28 ft-lbs of energy. When that pellet reaches 30 yards it’s only got 10 ft-lbs of energy.


I was hunting ducks over decoys using shells that were only doing 1350 fps. I got a double. One was motionless on the water and the other was skipping on the water so I chased him first with my canoe, as I was chasing him, the duck that I thought was stone dead on the water came too and flew buy me as I was chasing the other one. As I got closer to the second duck it too jumped up and took off. I know I hit and put pellets into both of them but the shells were just not strong enough to get the job done properly. Both ducks were shot within 30 yards. These were black ducks very similar in make up and size to a mallard. That's when I got into reloading steel shot. I wont use anything slower then 1450 fps for ducks anymore and my cripples have dropped dramatically.

If it was up to me and I could only afford one shot gun and I was planning on using it for ducks and geese I’d go for at least a 12 gauge that can handle 3 inch shells. That’s just my opinion and others may have varying ones. I’ve been hunting ducks for 24 years and using steel shot for 9 of them.

Good luck in making your decision I hope I’ve shed some light on the subject.

Marc.