Region 4 elk LEH

[J_T]

I stand corrected…..I thought it was the liberals who made that promise just before being voted out.

I don't think you are entirely incorrect. We know during an election most politicians make a swack of promises to gain support. I'm sure the Liberals offered money money money for wildlife. Yet, we never see the word, environment, or wildlife in the Speech from the Throne.....

[KootenayKiller]

One thing to keep in mind, is that bulls and cows both carry the genes for antler size. With people 'selecting' for 6 point bulls, they are not doing so for any cows with those genes. Factor in bull:cow ratios, and the effect size of artificial selection we're actually working with is 1/6th-1/10th as much as it would seem at a first glance.

If selection pressure is applied to one sex of the population only, rate of change is generally reduced according to the male:female ratio in the population. Notably, the same end outcome occurs as if selection pressure were applied to both sexes, but it takes more breeding cycles and thus longer to reach that same end point.

This assumes that the laws of Mendelian inheritance are applicable, which isn't always the case, but is a good general idea of the sort of response you will see. For example, if 15% of the population is male and selection pressure is applied to males only, Mendel's law of independent assortment suggests that 15% of change will occur per breeding cycle compared to a situation where selection pressure is applied to both sexes. There are all sorts of exceptions to these rules in population genetics, this is just what you can normally expect.

[wideopenthrottle]

https://www.naelk.org/the_genetic_question.cfm

i just found this link i havent read it yet though...read it...looks like the debate isnt settled

[KootenayKiller]

https://www.naelk.org/the_genetic_question.cfm

i just found this link i havent read it yet though

Non-mendelian inheritance patterns can result in situations where one sex of the population has a stronger influence. For example, if there were genes affecting antler size found in mitochondrial DNA (which is passed down by females only), then the selection pressures applied to males would have no effect on inheritance of those genes. Another possibility is gene linkages, which is where the location of genes on a chromosome relative to others can affect inheritance; genes situated close to one another are more likely to be jointly inherited. A classic example of linkage is found in the domestication of silver foxes, where more than a dozen traits unique to dogs appeared because of linkage to genes relating to docile behavior - even though they were not being selected for. A good point touched on in the article you cited is that bigger cows probably give birth to bigger bulls, which would presumably is tied to antler size also. Genetics can be very complex, and fascinating!

My assumption is that antler size is polygenic (involving many genes) and so probably follows Mendeliance inheritance patterns +/- a certain level of error, accounting for any such exceptions. To say that change won't occur because cows carry genes that affect antler size is probably not accurate. What is likely true is that this would reduce the rate of change.

[Walking Buffalo]

Again, all Kootenaykiller is doing is postulating, theorizing and assuming in an effort to replace the absence of any factual evidence proving regulated hunting has caused ANY genetic selection towards inhibiting six point antlers within Region 4 Elk.

KootenarKiller,
I suspect you are naive towards the anti-hunting advocacy groups efforts forced upon wildlife managers through the concept of hunter induced genetic selection, and the countering efforts of many scientists, managers and hunting advocates to refute the unfounded claims.

I have spent many thousands of hours over 25 years helping coordinate pro hunting efforts at an international level in the fight against these unfounded claims.

While I appreciate your inquisitive nature, don't let your ego replace facts.

[KootenayKiller]

Yes, just a hypothesis. Not sure where you think I replaced any facts because of my ego. I was just looking to have open discussion on the biology of elk. Too bad to avoid it over fear that the conversation will be misrepresented by anti-hunting groups.