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Thread: what would You do?

  1. #11
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    Re: what would You do?

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOwL View Post
    The popularity of hunting in B.C. is on the rise. The number of licensed hunters has increased more than 20 percent, from 85,633 hunters in 2005 to 107,073 in 2020. Hunting in B.C.
    Here's a quote from Jesse Zeman from 5 years ago in another thread about this same topic:

    Quote Originally Posted by GoatGuy View Post
    High point 1981 = 174,000 hunters

    Low point 2004 = 84,000

    2014 = 107,000
    In other words, there are as many hunters now as there were in 2014, and almost 70K less than there were in 1981
    "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority." - Benjamin Franklin

    "The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it" - George Orwell

  2. #12
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    Re: what would You do?

    hunter numbers will never be the issue. look at how many hunters there are in the USA. Twice or 3 times as many hunters on states that are a third of the size of BC! And way better hunting!
    They seem to generate much more money and put that money to better use managing the wildlife.

    designated wintering zones is one thing they do really well down there as well as predator management.

    edit: way better DEER hunting

  3. #13
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    Re: what would You do?

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOwL View Post
    Can the BCWF can help with that? TV programming, direct proposals to the Ministry of Lands and Forests... and hunters writing to Your MLA...
    Absolutely and they already are lobbying their asses off. Problem is, there aren't too many NDP'ers (or Liberals for that matter) in power who give a f-ck about wildlife management and only want to hand out as little amount of $$ as possible. The BCWF is starting to step up their game with more youtube videos and seminars which is great. I don't doubt that if they had a much bigger budget they could do a hell of a lot more.

    Maybe Mr Chipman will chime in. He's much more of an expert and has intimate knowledge
    "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority." - Benjamin Franklin

    "The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it" - George Orwell

  4. #14
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    Re: what would You do?

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOwL View Post
    regarding option 3 what do u propose to keep a balance between wildlife and a number of hunters? anyone?
    I have no idea what you are suggesting here. Do you believe the human footprint is causing a decline in wildlife? Or that hunters are harvesting to many? If so..... that it could be in some areas (LML) the human footprint has an impact on wildlife, but there is no data to support that hunting by itself is the cause of wildlife population decline.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOwL View Post
    If You could do something to save wildlife not only in BC but in all Canada, what would that be?
    An urgent course of action is:

    1. Stop logging in public land the most uncontrollable wave of destruction not only off Our forests but also wildlife are the victims of the greed wave.

    Under current private logging regulation, there is no limit or cap on the amount of wood a logging company can harvest annually, and there are no requirements to maintain forest cover or wildlife values. Additionally, there's no legal requirement for logging practices on private land to be sustainable over time.

    Disagree strongly with this initiative. To stop logging would cancel out the economic engine that runs BC. I have no issue with crown licence logging and private land logging. The 'issue' is the misguided social pressure to stop logging. Logging by itself is not the reason for the plight of wildlife in BC.


    Instead of a cease to logging, we should separate the Forestry component from our Land, Natural Resource management, and create a liaison between them. This would reduce the power and influence of logging. I can go on and on, but a viable forest sector is absolutely required in BC economically and for habitat development.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOwL View Post
    2. Cattle in public land;
    Cattle destroys the feeding grounds of ungulates and carnivores who feed in foliage, it is paramount to limit the number of cattle and the permits for grazing in public land, cattle and logging are the most dangerous enemies of wildlife, also destroys shelter and displace wildlife to unfamiliar grounds where most will die of thirst since wildlife remains within familiar terrain where they have shelter, food and water at hand.

    Cattle have a positive impact on the land in many situations. Let's not lose sight of the contribution of ranching (economics). Cattle on and off the land at key moments in the calendar year can have a positive impact on the land. Wildlife and cattle tolerate each other when on the same food sources. High fences…. Not so much.



    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOwL View Post
    3. A cap in the number of new hunters accepted each year must be imposed, we are in the wrong path where we are going to end up with a lot of hunters and no animals to hunt.


    Most of the time, hunters are targeted by the government and anti hunting organisations to distract the public from the real culprits for the decimation of wildlife.

    I'm not sure why limiting hunter involvement and hunter recruitment would be a good strategy.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOwL View Post
    As I see the present scenario is time for the BCWF to make a extra effort to help wildlife and to educate the public by means of TV programs with factual proof that the real cause of lost of animal habitat are logging, cattle and the indifference of the government.
    Iwould agree that the time is now for change to occur. If you believe nothing ishappening, I would suggest you are not very well informed.
    Take a look at the BC Fish, Wildlife Habitat Coalition. Led by the BCWF. Regional advisory boards, The "Togetherfor Wildlife" initiative . To namea few.

  5. #15
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    Re: what would You do?

    I’m not too sure I agree on the cattle. I have seen multiple areas I hunt absolutely thrashed by cattle. I would ask you for a single example of where the consistent over grazing I’ve seen is GOOD for the environment.
    If we’re not supposed to eat animals, how come they’re made out of meat?

    BHA, BCWF, CCFR, PETA, Lever Action Addict.

  6. #16
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    Re: what would You do?

    ^^ I wasn't sure if you had asked that of me, or someone else.

    I see cattle as one component of many to manage the land. In our area (and I respect different areas of the province are different) if/when we have a burn, putting cattle on the land post fire, helps to break down the decadent fuel and speed up the breakdown of wood. Where a fire has penetrated older forbes and shrubs, again, cattle step on the old dead wood and help to break that down. This really helps get some of the new growth started.

    To a certain extent cattle on the land base does impact forest ingrowth. As I recall a general rule‐of‐thumb was that wildlife and cattle should each be allocated25 percent of the available forage, with the remaining 50 percent left on‐the‐ground for ecosystem health. If cattle are taking more than their 25%, authorities should review the grazing licence.

    While Moose and Mule focus mostly on forbes and shrubs, elk and whitetail are the grass eaters of the ungulates. Elk generally don't eat grass that is full length (that being those grasses with the flowering top) so putting cattle on elk grazing land in the spring, can help create feed for elk, and keep elk on that area of land longer. If this is about getting elk off critical winter range that is private, this can be an asset.

    If an area is 'over' grazed by cattle, then there needs to be a discussion about the timing on grazing licences. Usually around here the cattle have to be off by October. Which does leave some forage for elk on 'transitional' land. If Cattle appear to be using more of the feed than they should, it raises the question about forest ingrowth. Has the land changed since the grazing licence was issued. Ungulates and cattle become compressed into smaller areas of land due to forest ingrowth. In this case, perhaps a burn or thinning of the ingrowth will create more food for cattle and elk.

  7. #17
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    Re: what would You do?

    Licensed Hunter numbers are not the issue. We had far far more years ago than present.

    Goodluck with removing Cattle, as the Cattleman's Association has more clout with government than any Wildlife group



    Over harvest of Forest, Forest management and access is a huge issue and government continues to almost give an open license to the big money outfits and continues to destroy wildlife habitat

    Unregulated hunting by a so called entitled hunter and special group, that requires no reporting, answers to no one, and remains unaccountable is certainly an issue. Two tiered systems of hunting for user groups only works in favor of the unlicensed unregulated hunter and does wildlife conservation no good period. It's obviously not working past and present.

    Until there is a government that is willing to put Wildlife, Fish, Conservation and Habitat First, and pour money into it, nothing will change. It will only get worse. Ive been hunting this Province for over 5 decades, Governments past and present do not value Fish and Wildlife like Fishers and Hunters, were a small group, with few votes. We don't matter, were not the ones that can assure the Pension checks keep coming.

    If it wasn't for groups like the WSSBC, BCWF, numerous volunteers through out the Province, we would be in worse shape than we are at present. Groups like this do care, and are doing the best with what they have. But it's Pickens, pocket change, GOVERNMENT needs commitment in Funding in too many places to list. It's heartbreaking actually watching continuous Governments year after year, do less and less for our Wildlife and Fish .

    It doesn't matter to most of this Province's population and will continue down the dark path it follows at this time. It's Votes that count, to make change, and that is not going to happen.
    Last edited by Imdone; 10-15-2021 at 03:39 PM.
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  8. #18
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    Re: what would You do?

    Quote Originally Posted by ACE View Post
    #1 Stop 24/7 year round legal​ hunting by a certain faction of the Canadian population.
    ^^^^ ding, ding, ding. Ace you nailed it.
    If you can pack it in, You can pack it out !!!

    UNITED WE STAND, DIVIDED WE FALL !!!


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    " The secret of change is to focus all your energy, not on fighting the old, but building on the new"
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  9. #19
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    Cool Re: what would You do?

    Canadian citizens only. Sorry landed immigrants.. Get your citizenship. If you cannot fluently speak English or French you cannot get a hunting license...duh!

  10. #20
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    Re: what would You do?

    Quote Originally Posted by ACE View Post
    Stop 24/7 year round legal​ hunting by a certain faction of the Canadian population.
    Where's the like button

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