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Thread: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

  1. #11
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    Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    Just adding this here from PA's Friday fishing Report for those that dont subscrbe to their newletter.
    (I would encourage folks that have interests in these waters to do so):

    Vancouver Saltwater Salmon Fishing Report
    As many of you know by now, the SFAB proposals for the Vancouver area were not accepted. Despite these proposals being specifically designed to minimize impact on stocks of concern and focus on hatchery fish, the Minister and her team said no. Once again, they took a hardline and did not accept well thought out, science-based proposals that offered them a chance to have balance when it comes to social and economic benefits vs protecting stocks of concern and maintaining FN constitutional rights.

    So why the denial of balance? I will be drilling into the details in the coming weeks, but preliminary reports indicate it was primarily a decision based on politics and pressures from ENGO and FN. All this despite the fact there are areas open up the coast that arguably have the same or more impact on stocks of concern. This is very telling. The ENGO and FN have Vancouver under a microscope. The current government has made it clear they don’t care about science, logic, or balance or the public fishery in general. If they did, they could have easily accepted the SFAB proposals. It would have posed little to no risk on stocks of concern, allowed a very, very modest opportunity to harvest hatchery chinook, and would not have impacted FN in river FSC opportunities. These proposals were for very small areas compared to where we would normally fish April, May, June in Vancouver, but even still they were denied.

    The PFA and SFI are continuing to lobby on your behalf for more chinook opportunities in our local waters. I would suggest you follow both of these organization on social media for further updates and how you can get involved.

    The next potential opportunity for chinook retention will be July 15, over at Thrasher and up towards Nanaimo. We won’t know about this until likely late June once the Integrated Fisheries Management Plan comes out. These days, literally anything can happen. That up-coming retention opportunity is not a guarantee either. It has been open there the last 2 years on July 15, so that is a good start, but with the DFO not meeting some management goals for stocks of concern last year, they might choose to impose further closures.

    They will never meet management goals by closing public fisheries or further closures in our area. I have seen the numbers; you can’t split this hair any finer or squeeze anymore blood out of this rock. I guess you would have to look at the 30,000 to 60,000 chinook taken by FN in gill nets in the Fraser each summer and how many of those are stocks of concern (thousands).

    Regarding the Fraser Mouth fishery that so many of us have enjoyed over the years, it is not likely we will see an opening before Sep 1. Keep in mind, these recent SFAB proposals that were not accepted were very precautionary. If they were accepted, you would only be able to fish up in Howe Sound and only for a hatchery fish (no Cowan to Roger Curtis or the Hump). Due to these not being accepted, I can’t imagine how a Fraser Mouth fishery proposal would be accepted. That being said, I will be submitting one via the SFAB process, but the chance of success in the current environment is low.

    Let me break it down for you. First Nations and ENGO are literally pushing DFO to abandon their responsibility to the public in managing chinook stocks in a balanced manner. If you don’t push back as a Canadian, you probably should just sell your boat, because you won’t be doing much fishing around Vancouver. I don’t expect much change until more people get involved and/or Trudeau and his agenda leave. I will leave it up to you if you want to get involved with your time, your money and your vote.
    Last edited by Bugle M In; 05-22-2021 at 02:29 PM.

  2. #12
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    Jun 2011
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    Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    Quote Originally Posted by Keta1969 View Post
    Exactly and this is why DFO is loath to designate any salmon or steelhead a Species at Risk. Even though they should the fallout would be huge. Bugle an expanded catch and release will not help wild stocks. Turning over fish to find a clipped fin is not the answer.
    you make it sound like clipped fish are a needle in a haystack, which is incorrect.
    SRKW are just window dressing here. They are also at historically average population levels.
    Any other reasons for closing this fishery? No. Solid no.

  3. #13
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    Nov 2008
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    Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Russell View Post
    you make it sound like clipped fish are a needle in a haystack, which is incorrect.
    SRKW are just window dressing here. They are also at historically average population levels.
    Any other reasons for closing this fishery? No. Solid no.
    Maybe you can explain to me how any catch and release fishery on stocks of low abundance are beneficial to that stock. I'm not just talking fin clipped but size limits as well. A nonclipped fish that dies may be one of a run that every fish is needed. Turning over fish looking for a clipped fin or the right size to fit a slot results in mortality. It's undeniable and documented and that is for the first time caught. How many times can a salmon be caught and released and not impacted. No one knows. They have seals and lions waiting and following boats around and then a long journey upriver ahead of them. FACT is some chinook and steelhead stocks are in serious trouble and are facing extinction. The fishery, if there should even be one needs to be managed to protect them.

  4. #14
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    Dec 2020
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    578

    Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    Quote Originally Posted by Keta1969 View Post
    Maybe you can explain to me how any catch and release fishery on stocks of low abundance are beneficial to that stock. I'm not just talking fin clipped but size limits as well. A nonclipped fish that dies may be one of a run that every fish is needed. Turning over fish looking for a clipped fin or the right size to fit a slot results in mortality. It's undeniable and documented and that is for the first time caught. How many times can a salmon be caught and released and not impacted. No one knows. They have seals and lions waiting and following boats around and then a long journey upriver ahead of them. FACT is some chinook and steelhead stocks are in serious trouble and are facing extinction. The fishery, if there should even be one needs to be managed to protect them.
    There should definitely be a fishery. Last year was one one the best years I’ve seen for chinooks. Until they are willing to shut down hearing fishing I’m not going to bite on the whole stocks at risk bullshit. This government is a disaster both provincial and federal.

  5. #15
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    Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    Quote Originally Posted by Blacktail1 View Post
    There should definitely be a fishery. Last year was one one the best years I’ve seen for chinooks. Until they are willing to shut down hearing fishing I’m not going to bite on the whole stocks at risk bullshit. This government is a disaster both provincial and federal.
    Ok then it's all BS. Bang away till they're done. Blaming another user group and wanting to carry on as usual has been the story of salmon's decline.

  6. #16
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    Arrow Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    Quote Originally Posted by Keta1969 View Post
    ... FACT is some chinook and steelhead stocks are in serious trouble and are facing extinction. The fishery, if there should even be one needs to be managed to protect them.
    Yep. some are.
    Yet the DFO allows indiscriminate gill and drift net fisheries in river on the MOST endangered of the lot.
    To date, there have been no less than ten such officially sanctioned openings for you know who.
    And their target is among the most endangered springs the Fraser holds.

    Employing historic DNA analysis and tag recoveries to avoid stocks of concern would work, and allow marked fisheries to proceed in certain areas at certain times.
    However DFO won't even entertain the idea whatsoever.
    Their peculiar vision of salmon fisheries simply does not include the recreational sector at all.

    Sad,
    Nog
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVNNhzkJ-UU&feature=related

    Egotistical, Self Centered, Son of a Bitch Killer that Doesn't Play Well With Others.

    Guess he got to Know me

  7. #17
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    Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    Quote Originally Posted by IronNoggin View Post
    Yep. some are.
    Yet the DFO allows indiscriminate gill and drift net fisheries in river on the MOST endangered of the lot.
    To date, there have been no less than ten such officially sanctioned openings for you know who.
    And their target is among the most endangered springs the Fraser holds.

    Employing historic DNA analysis and tag recoveries to avoid stocks of concern would work, and allow marked fisheries to proceed in certain areas at certain times.
    However DFO won't even entertain the idea whatsoever.
    Their peculiar vision of salmon fisheries simply does not include the recreational sector at all.

    Sad,
    Nog
    Nog I hear you. I've been around fisheries for a long time. But the reality is that the blame game is done. I will absolutely agree that in river fishing has been a disaster. I remember when we went to the AFS after the Sparrow decision. Any accountability that bands had was lost and now apparently any individual can do as they please. But why is that? Because the courts have said so. I'm no fan of DFO but what should they do when the courts say that natives have first priority RIGHTS. They allow it because they have no choice. I still think catch and release is a joke on intrception fisheries. Maybe there is a place for it in Alberni Canal or somewhere similar where you have a better idea of what you're catching. Anyhow I think sooner rather than later a Species at Risk designation will be given to some of those stocks and then DFO will have to act but if recreational fishermen think they'll be fishing when the natives aren't they are dreaming.

  8. #18
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    Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    The thing is, many of the stocks of concern (upper fraser run), are "not" the ones being caught, say at Thrasher etc.
    If you do catch a clipped one, it is most likely 1 from the states because we only clip 10% as compared to 100% in the USA.

    That is the issue.
    Sportsman arent asking to "target the runs of concern".!
    The only ones hammering them is the FN, and it should have stopped a long time ago, just like with the steelhead.
    No one is asking to be first before FN on this subject.

    If the DFO, or rather the minister in charge supply clipping machines, so as to do 100% hatchery, we wouldn't have to hook
    tons of salmon looking for a gem that is clipped, AND, fits in the slot limit etc.

    There has been a lot of dna clipping by the sports fishing folks, and there is enough evidence to support it being open.
    AND, these past few years, many of the actual DFO Bio's are "in support" of the SFA requests.

    The stocks of concern arent being affected to any extent that the FN are doing on the run going up the river.
    If there is anyone targeting the actual stocks of concern, it is them, "at this point".
    Not trying to blame them for the whole problem and how we got here, not at all.

    And its the ministry that is causing the sport fishing folks to "have to play with their catch" due to the restrictions.
    The DFO is making it worst.
    The Minister and the Libs are totally F'ing it up.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Posts
    578

    Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bugle M In;[URL="tel:2255976"
    2255976[/URL]]The thing is, many of the stocks of concern (upper fraser run), are "not" the ones being caught, say at Thrasher etc.
    If you do catch a clipped one, it is most likely 1 from the states because we only clip 10% as compared to 100% in the USA.

    That is the issue.
    Sportsman arent asking to "target the runs of concern".!
    The only ones hammering them is the FN, and it should have stopped a long time ago, just like with the steelhead.
    No one is asking to be first before FN on this subject.

    If the DFO, or rather the minister in charge supply clipping machines, so as to do 100% hatchery, we wouldn't have to hook
    tons of salmon looking for a gem that is clipped, AND, fits in the slot limit etc.

    There has been a lot of dna clipping by the sports fishing folks, and there is enough evidence to support it being open.
    AND, these past few years, many of the actual DFO Bio's are "in support" of the SFA requests.

    The stocks of concern arent being affected to any extent that the FN are doing on the run going up the river.
    If there is anyone targeting the actual stocks of concern, it is them, "at this point".
    Not trying to blame them for the whole problem and how we got here, not at all.

    And its the ministry that is causing the sport fishing folks to "have to play with their catch" due to the restrictions.
    The DFO is making it worst.
    The Minister and the Libs are totally F'ing it up.
    I could not agree more!!!

  10. #20
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    Sep 2009
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    Arrow Re: CHINOOK UPDATE JUST RELEASED (Bad News)

    Here is the SFAB response letter to Minister Jordan on the Chinook Proposals:

    https://mcusercontent.com/efe5de6efa...tter_Final.pdf
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVNNhzkJ-UU&feature=related

    Egotistical, Self Centered, Son of a Bitch Killer that Doesn't Play Well With Others.

    Guess he got to Know me

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