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Thread: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

  1. #181
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Indigenous title rests on the foundation of our legal system. You have as much chance of fighting that, as a snowballs chance in hell.
    Whether you like it or not, our laws derrive from British law and common law.
    The challenge will be to sort out this sorry mess, brought about by a century of denial and avoidance, with no small participation of a starkly racist population.
    It is not right for fee simple titles to be in jeopardy of being undervalued or discounted.
    Denying the reality of historical injustice won't get any happy endings.
    Making new injustices seems almost inevitable.

  2. #182
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    I've never heard of a treaty lasting as long as these. Traditionally, they're unilaterally renegotiated every fifty years or so.

    If you accept the validity of eminent domain, it's possible.
    Quote Originally Posted by ElectricDyck View Post
    ....i dont buy ** fish ..its like buying your stolen tools back from a crack head..

  3. #183
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by wildcatter View Post
    "Bottom line: Indigenous title is a real thing that's been recognized by Canadian courts.
    We can keep pretending that the recoginition of Indigenous title isn't a real thing"


    Rob, is the Indigenous Title based on some oral records told by a bunch of drunken indians at the campfire smoking a peace pipe?
    This is as blunt as I can put it.
    I have a some more thoughts, but I would be banned if I type it in here.

    Man, that made me laugh! Don't get offended, but I think you need some blunt talk as well.

    Look, I understand you're frustrated, but I think you need to start thinking about this a bit before you share your thoughts.

    First, Indigenous title is traced back to the King of England and the Royal Proclamation of 1793 (and no, it wasn't the king running the show just like today, it was a bunch of politicians). We all know (or should know by now) where Indigenous title comes from.

    After being recognized for political purposes by the Crown Indigenous title has been repeatedly tested and recognized in Canadian courts of law.

    It's got nothing to do with oral history and it's not something you can blame First Nations for. The British crown, acting through the British Parliament, are the ones to blame. If you want to throw barbs at someone, aim them waaaay further east, across the ocean.

    Something else you may not have thought through: social media is public. When you say things like "some oral records told by a bunch of drunken indians at the campfire smoking a peace pipe" you're giving anti-hunters ammunition to call all of us racists. You know exactly what a screen shot is. Now, we often say hunters should stick together and support each other because we're in the same boat.

    Some of us are chopping holes in the boat. Those guys have to stop doing that.

    Again, I get that you're frustrated, but how about you adopt my gun control policy? Hit the right ****ing target.


    Quote Originally Posted by wildcatter View Post
    "How nice, they wash their hands and say you are on your own.
    And it's TFB if the indians offer you one tenth of your property's worth.
    Are you OK with that?

    Again, I think you're getting confused. It doesn't matter what I'm ok with. Why would it? That's like asking if I'm "ok" with taxes, or rain, or forest fires. I never caused this problem and I can't cure it. I'm not celebrating it and, importantly, I'm not crying about it. I'm trying to figure out how to deal with it.


    If you're not happy with it you should do something effective about it, or at least don't make things worse. Check your watch. Look at the date. The year is probably going to say something like "2021", not "1965". Like it or not we are where we are. When you say stuff in public like "indians" and "your property" you're in complete denial about how the game we're in is played. There is a legal argument to be made that "your property" is stolen property. Again I'm the messenger. Don't shoot me for telling you what the real world looks like today.

    In the current game we're on our own. Indigenous people have Canadian law squarely on their side, and they've got G2G status in negotiations. Regular guys like you and I have to depend on the provincial and federal governments to look out for our interests. If you think they're going to do that then you've clearly been smoking crack. They are not looking out for us. That is the very nature of the problem. Woodward is right when he says most of BC is in for a shock.

    You know what the shock will look like, right? I'll look an awful lot like what people in the Tsilhqot’in Nation Declared Title Lands have experienced.

    You're like the guy not he team taking dumb penalties for no good reason. You are only hurting other hunters by pretending that the world isn't what it is and throwing around racist slurs (which really aren't a good look at the best of times).

    Again, I get that you're frustrated. A lot of people are. Don't make things worse.
    Rob Chipman
    "The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders" - Ed Abbey
    "Grown men do not need leaders" - also Ed Abbey

  4. #184
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Chipman View Post
    Man, that made me laugh! Don't get offended, but I think you need some blunt talk as well.

    Look, I understand you're frustrated, but I think you need to start thinking about this a bit before you share your thoughts.

    First, Indigenous title is traced back to the King of England and the Royal Proclamation of 1793 (and no, it wasn't the king running the show just like today, it was a bunch of politicians). We all know (or should know by now) where Indigenous title comes from.

    After being recognized for political purposes by the Crown Indigenous title has been repeatedly tested and recognized in Canadian courts of law.

    It's got nothing to do with oral history and it's not something you can blame First Nations for. The British crown, acting through the British Parliament, are the ones to blame. If you want to throw barbs at someone, aim them waaaay further east, across the ocean.

    Something else you may not have thought through: social media is public. When you say things like "some oral records told by a bunch of drunken indians at the campfire smoking a peace pipe" you're giving anti-hunters ammunition to call all of us racists. You know exactly what a screen shot is. Now, we often say hunters should stick together and support each other because we're in the same boat.

    Some of us are chopping holes in the boat. Those guys have to stop doing that.

    Again, I get that you're frustrated, but how about you adopt my gun control policy? Hit the right ****ing target.





    Again, I think you're getting confused. It doesn't matter what I'm ok with. Why would it? That's like asking if I'm "ok" with taxes, or rain, or forest fires. I never caused this problem and I can't cure it. I'm not celebrating it and, importantly, I'm not crying about it. I'm trying to figure out how to deal with it.


    If you're not happy with it you should do something effective about it, or at least don't make things worse. Check your watch. Look at the date. The year is probably going to say something like "2021", not "1965". Like it or not we are where we are. When you say stuff in public like "indians" and "your property" you're in complete denial about how the game we're in is played. There is a legal argument to be made that "your property" is stolen property. Again I'm the messenger. Don't shoot me for telling you what the real world looks like today.

    In the current game we're on our own. Indigenous people have Canadian law squarely on their side, and they've got G2G status in negotiations. Regular guys like you and I have to depend on the provincial and federal governments to look out for our interests. If you think they're going to do that then you've clearly been smoking crack. They are not looking out for us. That is the very nature of the problem. Woodward is right when he says most of BC is in for a shock.

    You know what the shock will look like, right? I'll look an awful lot like what people in the Tsilhqot’in Nation Declared Title Lands have experienced.

    You're like the guy not he team taking dumb penalties for no good reason. You are only hurting other hunters by pretending that the world isn't what it is and throwing around racist slurs (which really aren't a good look at the best of times).

    Again, I get that you're frustrated. A lot of people are. Don't make things worse.
    Um is that what the kids these days refer to as a "Mic drop"?

    You couldn't have laid it out any more clearly Rob. People need to realize that anti's do read these forums and look for any ammunition they can find to use against us. Being characterized as trophy hunting killers who only care about the "killing" part is one thing; but being characterized by the Anti's as racist trophy hunting killers is in another league altogether and we don't need any more players on the team taking dumb penalties - we're already playing shorthanded FFS
    "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority." - Benjamin Franklin

    "The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it" - George Orwell

  5. #185
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Chipman View Post
    Man, that made me laugh! Don't get offended, but I think you need some blunt talk as well.

    Look, I understand you're frustrated, but I think you need to start thinking about this a bit before you share your thoughts.

    First, Indigenous title is traced back to the King of England and the Royal Proclamation of 1793 (and no, it wasn't the king running the show just like today, it was a bunch of politicians). We all know (or should know by now) where Indigenous title comes from.

    After being recognized for political purposes by the Crown Indigenous title has been repeatedly tested and recognized in Canadian courts of law.

    It's got nothing to do with oral history and it's not something you can blame First Nations for. The British crown, acting through the British Parliament, are the ones to blame. If you want to throw barbs at someone, aim them waaaay further east, across the ocean.

    Something else you may not have thought through: social media is public. When you say things like "some oral records told by a bunch of drunken indians at the campfire smoking a peace pipe" you're giving anti-hunters ammunition to call all of us racists. You know exactly what a screen shot is. Now, we often say hunters should stick together and support each other because we're in the same boat.

    Some of us are chopping holes in the boat. Those guys have to stop doing that.

    Again, I get that you're frustrated, but how about you adopt my gun control policy? Hit the right ****ing target.





    Again, I think you're getting confused. It doesn't matter what I'm ok with. Why would it? That's like asking if I'm "ok" with taxes, or rain, or forest fires. I never caused this problem and I can't cure it. I'm not celebrating it and, importantly, I'm not crying about it. I'm trying to figure out how to deal with it.


    If you're not happy with it you should do something effective about it, or at least don't make things worse. Check your watch. Look at the date. The year is probably going to say something like "2021", not "1965". Like it or not we are where we are. When you say stuff in public like "indians" and "your property" you're in complete denial about how the game we're in is played. There is a legal argument to be made that "your property" is stolen property. Again I'm the messenger. Don't shoot me for telling you what the real world looks like today.

    In the current game we're on our own. Indigenous people have Canadian law squarely on their side, and they've got G2G status in negotiations. Regular guys like you and I have to depend on the provincial and federal governments to look out for our interests. If you think they're going to do that then you've clearly been smoking crack. They are not looking out for us. That is the very nature of the problem. Woodward is right when he says most of BC is in for a shock.

    You know what the shock will look like, right? I'll look an awful lot like what people in the Tsilhqot’in Nation Declared Title Lands have experienced.

    You're like the guy not he team taking dumb penalties for no good reason. You are only hurting other hunters by pretending that the world isn't what it is and throwing around racist slurs (which really aren't a good look at the best of times).

    Again, I get that you're frustrated. A lot of people are. Don't make things worse.
    Rob, the British Crown is as relevant as I am being the Pope, the whole system is crooked and badly needs an overhaul.
    Is it racist to call an indian an indian?
    I wish my property was stolen land, instead of me paying big bucks for it.
    I also know that BC is in for a shock and I hope it's gonna be such a huge shock that it will eventually lead to big changes.
    And being racist? - you got to be kidding.
    One member here said this: "the school putting my 4 year old in a small storage room during Cree class because she's white"
    Did you read the post "Only white people can be racist"?
    Anything we say these days is racist, so I'm not gonna pretend and pussyfoot around these issues.
    Eventually you have to pick a side!
    WLM
    I have a very strict gun control policy: if there's a gun around, I want to be in control of it. - Clint Eastwood
    "Lots of critters to still shoot. And there'll be no quitters until we bag some critters" - 180grainer
    "Politicians should wear sponsor jackets like Nascar drivers, then we know who owns them" - Robin Williams

    Flush the Turd!

    Located and residing on the unceded territory of European Settler's traditional land.
    Click here to learn more 🖕

  6. #186
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Harvest the Land View Post
    Um is that what the kids these days refer to as a "Mic drop"?

    You couldn't have laid it out any more clearly Rob. People need to realize that anti's do read these forums and look for any ammunition they can find to use against us. Being characterized as trophy hunting killers who only care about the "killing" part is one thing; but being characterized by the Anti's as racist trophy hunting killers is in another league altogether and we don't need any more players on the team taking dumb penalties - we're already playing shorthanded FFS
    So hunters saying there not going to follow the travel ban would that be considered giving the antis ammo, like saying look hunters cant follow regulations they will do what ever they want to go kill something.
    Would that be considered a dumb penalty.

  7. #187
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by wildcatter View Post
    Is it racist to call an indian an indian?
    I don't think its racist to use the word Indian, BUT that's coming from a whitey who's half Dutch. It might be better to ask an Indigenous person if they think "its racist to call an Indian an Indian". I do think that most of them prefer to be referred to as First Nations or Indigenous people rather than Indians, but again this is coming from someone who not native.

    But I think anybody, regardless of the colour of their skin would agree that saying shit like "a bunch of drunken indians at the campfire smoking a peace pipe" might be construed by some as derogatory or racist.

    You might have a different opinion and you're entitled to it
    "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority." - Benjamin Franklin

    "The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it" - George Orwell

  8. #188
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by LBM View Post
    So hunters saying there not going to follow the travel ban would that be considered giving the antis ammo, like saying look hunters cant follow regulations they will do what ever they want to go kill something.
    Would that be considered a dumb penalty.
    I happen to have a company truck with signs on it. If I get stopped by a road block, I will be telling them that yes my travel is for work and it is essential (which won't be entirely untrue). I probably won't tell them (unless they ask) that I'm also travelling with my .308 and plan on making a detour up a logging road with the hopes of filling my freezer
    "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority." - Benjamin Franklin

    "The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it" - George Orwell

  9. #189
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Originally Posted by wildcatter
    Is it racist to call an indian an indian?

    ABSOLUTELY NOT ! The Federal goverment has Referred to indians as indians for YEAR's The land plots GIVEN to them are still called INDIAN Reservations ! RJ

  10. #190
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Harvest the Land View Post
    I don't think its racist to use the word Indian, BUT that's coming from a whitey who's half Dutch. It might be better to ask an Indigenous person if they think "its racist to call an Indian an Indian". I do think that most of them prefer to be referred to as First Nations or Indigenous people rather than Indians, but again this is coming from someone who not native.

    But I think anybody, regardless of the colour of their skin would agree that saying shit like "a bunch of drunken indians at the campfire smoking a peace pipe" might be construed by some as derogatory or racist.

    You might have a different opinion and you're entitled to it

    Yeah I know, I did that on purpose, why not everybody can say what ever they want about us whites, so let's return the favor.
    By the way, I refuse to call them First Nations, because they are not.
    Last edited by wildcatter; 04-27-2021 at 10:19 PM.
    WLM
    I have a very strict gun control policy: if there's a gun around, I want to be in control of it. - Clint Eastwood
    "Lots of critters to still shoot. And there'll be no quitters until we bag some critters" - 180grainer
    "Politicians should wear sponsor jackets like Nascar drivers, then we know who owns them" - Robin Williams

    Flush the Turd!

    Located and residing on the unceded territory of European Settler's traditional land.
    Click here to learn more 🖕

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