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Thread: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

  1. #171
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Chipman View Post
    Maybe Woodward isn't so much writing cheques as pointing out which cheques have already been cashed. He's using provocative language, but the Tsilhqot'in Nation Declared Title Lands decision is a fact that exists and has big implications. It was on BC government websites at least 2 years ago, I'm sure (and I referenced it here) that fee simple ownership and Indigenous title would have to be figured out. When I first read that I could not believe my eyes - I'm a realtor with over 3 decades in the business, so the concept of fee simple being pretty much inviolable was ingrained.

    Guess what? It's not. Survey the web pages of law firms that work in this are and you'll quickly see that Indigenous title is often thought to be incompatible with fee simple title granted by the crown, and that fee simple is inferior to Indigenous title.

    That has not been ruled on conclusively by Canadian courts, but it is up for grabs.

    And like his opinion or not, Woodward is very knowledgeable in this area.

    It's important to recognize that what most of us have always assumed to be a fact that won't change, that is, the concept of "Crown land" is very much up for grabs. In some circles the use of the term "Crown land" is simply unacceptable.

    Don't shoot me - I'm just the messenger.

    Sorry, I don't understand the Indigenous Land Title.
    What is that?
    Who granted indigenous people a title?
    Some king from some foreign land in a paper that's not worth ink it's written on.
    British King.
    Is this Britain?
    Who the hell is he and what authority or relevance does he have in Canada?
    Britain and British have nothing to do with Canada. They are tiny minority here.

    People don't understand one basic thing.
    It will be what you want it to be.
    If you show up, it will be what you want.
    If you don't show up, it will be what your enemies want.

    The problem with European descendants is their lives are way too comfortable and they are lazy.
    They don't want to put the work in.
    But push them over the edge and sword is what you will get usually.
    1. Human over population
    2. Government burden and overreach

  2. #172
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Chipman View Post
    Maybe Woodward isn't so much writing cheques as pointing out which cheques have already been cashed. He's using provocative language, but the Tsilhqot'in Nation Declared Title Lands decision is a fact that exists and has big implications. It was on BC government websites at least 2 years ago, I'm sure (and I referenced it here) that fee simple ownership and Indigenous title would have to be figured out. When I first read that I could not believe my eyes - I'm a realtor with over 3 decades in the business, so the concept of fee simple being pretty much inviolable was ingrained.

    Guess what? It's not. Survey the web pages of law firms that work in this are and you'll quickly see that Indigenous title is often thought to be incompatible with fee simple title granted by the crown, and that fee simple is inferior to Indigenous title.

    That has not been ruled on conclusively by Canadian courts, but it is up for grabs.

    And like his opinion or not, Woodward is very knowledgeable in this area.

    It's important to recognize that what most of us have always assumed to be a fact that won't change, that is, the concept of "Crown land" is very much up for grabs. In some circles the use of the term "Crown land" is simply unacceptable.

    Don't shoot me - I'm just the messenger.
    Well said. Like it or not, this will be the new reality that will be really tough for some to fathom/accept/understand. Make no mistake there is a reckoning coming and its coming faster than anyone imagined even 5 years ago.

    Sure Woodward is a lawyer who represents FN's and he absolutely has an agenda. But he's serious as F_ck and he's got the street cred with that monumental 2014 case to back up much of what he's saying. And its important to carefully listen to what he says because some of it will come to fruition and then you all won't be caught off guard after the courts have their say
    "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority." - Benjamin Franklin

    "The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it" - George Orwell

  3. #173
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    @Surrey Boy: you are not seriously quoting Adolf Hitler as a reference for a politically reasonable political approach?
    The 375 Ruger was improved the day it was necked down to 9.3 mm

  4. #174
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by adriaticum View Post
    Sorry, I don't understand the Indigenous Land Title.
    What is that?
    Who granted indigenous people a title?
    Some king from some foreign land in a paper that's not worth ink it's written on.
    British King.
    Is this Britain?
    Who the hell is he and what authority or relevance does he have in Canada?
    Britain and British have nothing to do with Canada. They are tiny minority here.

    People don't understand one basic thing.
    It will be what you want it to be.
    If you show up, it will be what you want.
    If you don't show up, it will be what your enemies want.

    The problem with European descendants is their lives are way too comfortable and they are lazy.
    They don't want to put the work in.
    But push them over the edge and sword is what you will get usually.



    You understand it perfectly! You just don't want to accept it, which is completely fair. The problem you face is that if you don't want to accept what the powerful are doing you have to oppose them, and you and I both know how hard that is, and how the prospect of success is fairly low (revolutions do succeed, but they are not common).

    Britain and the British and the British King (from a few centuries ago) have plenty to do with Canada. The concept is "honour of the Crown", meaning if the Crown did something in 1763 that we find kind of stupid today we still have to abide by it because of...the honour of the Crown. Again, you understand that, but may not want to accept it (and there is a reasonable argument for rejecting it, but boy oh boy you'd be facing an uphill climb).

    Then, of course, there's the whole common law president thing.

    Bottom line: Indigenous title is a real thing that's been recognized by Canadian courts. We can keep pretending that the recoginition of Indigenous title isn't a real thing, but it's not a strategy that's going to work unless you've got people ready to take up arms and oppose the current government structure in this country. I can't see that happening.

    Do you have another way to get around Indigenous title?
    Rob Chipman
    "The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders" - Ed Abbey
    "Grown men do not need leaders" - also Ed Abbey

  5. #175
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    They seem to use our "colonial" laws when it serves their purposes; such as claiming title. But tend to deride and even ignore the laws when they don't serve their purpose...and our politicians let them.

    Their selective use and manipulation of legal principles does them no credit...but our politicians don't care.

    And for some; they don't want "reconciliation" through title. They want vengeance. And that's what scares me.

  6. #176
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    So will the indians be on their own now? Doubt it they will keep sucking that tit until they get all the land, funny how they account for 1% of the population but they are the tail thats wagging the dog! The government will have greatly reduced tax revenue so it will be a double whammy, you'll get taxed extra while the indians are dining on caviar!
    I like drinking beer and whiskey, shooting guns, jetboating, love a nice rack and a tight line, I am simply a sophisticated redneck...

  7. #177
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Chipman View Post


    You understand it perfectly! You just don't want to accept it, which is completely fair. The problem you face is that if you don't want to accept what the powerful are doing you have to oppose them, and you and I both know how hard that is, and how the prospect of success is fairly low (revolutions do succeed, but they are not common).

    Britain and the British and the British King (from a few centuries ago) have plenty to do with Canada. The concept is "honour of the Crown", meaning if the Crown did something in 1763 that we find kind of stupid today we still have to abide by it because of...the honour of the Crown. Again, you understand that, but may not want to accept it (and there is a reasonable argument for rejecting it, but boy oh boy you'd be facing an uphill climb).

    Then, of course, there's the whole common law president thing.

    Bottom line: Indigenous title is a real thing that's been recognized by Canadian courts. We can keep pretending that the recoginition of Indigenous title isn't a real thing, but it's not a strategy that's going to work unless you've got people ready to take up arms and oppose the current government structure in this country. I can't see that happening.

    Do you have another way to get around Indigenous title?

    We understand each other.
    Yes I have many ways to get around the title, but nobody is listening.
    One way is to eliminate the monarchy.
    Another way is to get out of this mess called Canada and finally form our own land for our own people.
    And so forth.

    I am not necessarily in oppositin of Indigenous title. I don't have any evidence that FNs would be worse government than we currently have.
    But I am in opposition to removing any people residing on any title from their land and I am willing to fight that.

    To me government is like toilet paper.
    Only to be used once.
    Last edited by adriaticum; 04-27-2021 at 03:13 PM.
    1. Human over population
    2. Government burden and overreach

  8. #178
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    Thumbs down Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    'Large chunks' of B.C. Crown land could end up in hands of Indigenous Nations

    Opinion: Aboriginal title over large tracts of 95 per cent of B.C. that's now referred to as Crown land would entail “huge transfer of wealth.”

    Woodward, in one of his more provocative comments, suggests that where Aboriginal title is recognized, a Crown tenure is “a worthless piece of paper.” The province will probably have to provide some sort of compensation for tenure-holders. The end result, says Woodward, will be local control by First Nations, as opposed to forestry and other tenures being held by multinational corporations.

    https://vancouversun.com/opinion/col...that-to-public
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVNNhzkJ-UU&feature=related

    Egotistical, Self Centered, Son of a Bitch Killer that Doesn't Play Well With Others.

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  9. #179
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Chipman View Post


    You understand it perfectly! You just don't want to accept it, which is completely fair. The problem you face is that if you don't want to accept what the powerful are doing you have to oppose them, and you and I both know how hard that is, and how the prospect of success is fairly low (revolutions do succeed, but they are not common).

    Britain and the British and the British King (from a few centuries ago) have plenty to do with Canada. The concept is "honour of the Crown", meaning if the Crown did something in 1763 that we find kind of stupid today we still have to abide by it because of...the honour of the Crown. Again, you understand that, but may not want to accept it (and there is a reasonable argument for rejecting it, but boy oh boy you'd be facing an uphill climb).

    Then, of course, there's the whole common law president thing.

    Bottom line: Indigenous title is a real thing that's been recognized by Canadian courts. We can keep pretending that the recoginition of Indigenous title isn't a real thing, but it's not a strategy that's going to work unless you've got people ready to take up arms and oppose the current government structure in this country. I can't see that happening.

    Do you have another way to get around Indigenous title?
    "Bottom line: Indigenous title is a real thing that's been recognized by Canadian courts.
    We can keep pretending that the recoginition of Indigenous title isn't a real thing"


    Rob, is the Indigenous Title based on some oral records told by a bunch of drunken indians at the campfire smoking a peace pipe?
    This is as blunt as I can put it.
    I have a some more thoughts, but I would be banned if I type it in here.
    WLM
    I have a very strict gun control policy: if there's a gun around, I want to be in control of it. - Clint Eastwood
    "Lots of critters to still shoot. And there'll be no quitters until we bag some critters" - 180grainer
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    Flush the Turd!

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  10. #180
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    Re: Crown Land Given To Now Be FN Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Chipman View Post
    There's a bit of info on that
    here:

    https://www.wltribune.com/news/lodge...or-fair-price/
    One quote from the article:
    "Plank said the province remains a neutral party in any purchase negotiations between the tourism operators and the First Nation."

    How nice, they wash their hands and say you are on your own.
    And it's TFB if the indians offer you one tenth of your property's worth.
    Are you OK with that?
    WLM
    I have a very strict gun control policy: if there's a gun around, I want to be in control of it. - Clint Eastwood
    "Lots of critters to still shoot. And there'll be no quitters until we bag some critters" - 180grainer
    "Politicians should wear sponsor jackets like Nascar drivers, then we know who owns them" - Robin Williams

    Flush the Turd!

    Located and residing on the unceded territory of European Settler's traditional land.
    Click here to learn more 🖕

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