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Thread: Jeff Werner on Moose

  1. #1
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    Jeff Werner on Moose

    Never say whoa in the middle of a mud hole

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  3. #2
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    Re: Jeff Werner on Moose

    21% of collared moose mortality attributed to acute starvation ...........huh
    Never say whoa in the middle of a mud hole

  4. #3
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    Re: Jeff Werner on Moose

    Very interesting to see that various assumptions of the nutritional values of different species, as well as the seasonal values, and growth locations are being studied in a scientific way. Human industrial activity is a fact of life in B.C. , but perhaps carrying out that activity at something less than 100% fibre recovery could have enormous benefit to Moose populations. The focus on the harvest of one species at the expense of other resources in the Province of B.C. is in need of change. The negative effect of enormous ungulate unfriendly cut-blocks is clear. Is there a column on the bean counter's ledger for wildlife... not yet !

  5. #4
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    Re: Jeff Werner on Moose

    This report says 16% starvation. See pie chart on page 13.

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ikG...w?usp=drivesdk
    Last edited by huntingfamily; 06-08-2020 at 05:43 PM.

  6. #5
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    Re: Jeff Werner on Moose

    Cut blocks are supposed to be the tender vittle buffet for ungulates
    Someone doesn't have their science on straight
    Never say whoa in the middle of a mud hole

  7. #6
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    Re: Jeff Werner on Moose

    Well, that was an excellent find. Thanks Boxhitch.
    Rob Chipman
    "The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders" - Ed Abbey
    "Grown men do not need leaders" - also Ed Abbey

  8. #7
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    Re: Jeff Werner on Moose

    Quote Originally Posted by boxhitch View Post
    Cut blocks are supposed to be the tender vittle buffet for ungulates
    Someone doesn't have their science on straight
    Unless the cut blocks are sprayed to stop the good vittles from growing......
    Trudeau is a Neya Noonan Utim Tugeye

  9. #8
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    Re: Jeff Werner on Moose

    Quote Originally Posted by boxhitch View Post
    Cut blocks are supposed to be the tender vittle buffet for ungulates
    Someone doesn't have their science on straight
    I would think it depends on the agenda of those using " science "

  10. #9
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    Re: Jeff Werner on Moose

    Quote Originally Posted by boxhitch View Post
    Cut blocks are supposed to be the tender vittle buffet for ungulates
    Someone doesn't have their science on straight
    Why?
    Who?


    I suggest Jeff spends some more time learning from the 'shrooms.
    He has some great insight, but needs to connect these threads.

    I hope those that watch this realize how narrow and infantile (young) the research is.
    Jeff acknowledges that this is just the beginning of trying to understand what is going on.

    My concern is that developing the science can be much too slow and expensive to react in time when biological concerns arise.
    This could be another case where we won't know what went wrong until it is much too late to do anything about it.

  11. #10
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    Re: Jeff Werner on Moose

    "developing the science can be much too slow and expensive to react in time"

    Good observation. Science is slow, and it really only discovers little bits of information that need to be sewn together over time, and subjected to all the sorts of critiques that other scientists can throw at the emerging conclusions.

    I'd re-frame the "expensive" a bit. Let's suspend criticism of Dr. Werner for a second and just pretend that all his work about tannins reducing digestible proteins is 100% on point, and that it does result in moose starving with full bellies. That's a huge loss, and you could calculate that into a dollar figure.

    Who's incurring that loss? It doesn't turn up on forest company balance sheets, or government balance sheets either.

    Both those entities deal in really, really big numbers.


    Dr. Werner, on the other hand, indicates that analyzing the results of his turd
    burgling is *really expensive*. It probably isn't very expensive at all in the big scheme of things. I'm obviously speculating, but what's it cost to analyze a bunch of moose turds, (or do CWD testing on some deer heads) compared to throwing a bridge over a creek and punching in a road to get some timber? Or (dare I say it) what's it cost to analyze moose turns compared to trying to get a seat on the UN Security Council?

    "
    Someone doesn't have their science on straight"

    I think that's a common problem, but one of the important values of science is (and Dr. Werner indicated this) is that it has to potential to self-correct in the wide open because it's impartial and honest. Anyone watching the information we get on Covid (by no means impartial or honest) has got to see the value in more honesty and impartiality.


    I'd be remiss in not acknowledging how great it is that UNBC makes these lectures available for knuckleheads like us. Very good stuff.

    Rob Chipman
    "The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders" - Ed Abbey
    "Grown men do not need leaders" - also Ed Abbey

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