Moose age by antler size

[Bustercluck]

I stumbled across this today. I’m not sure if it’s been posted here before, but still a good discussion item.

https://www.all-about-moose.com/moose-antlers.html

This conversation has come up at moose camp a few times. The one time it actually made a difference was the one year we went up to fort Nelson looking for a ten point or better. After some discussion about counting points we kind of made a loose agreement if the bull has a full palm and some brow tines he probably has either ten points or three on the brow. Out of the bulls we’ve seen that have a full palm and brow tines they’ve all passed as a ten point or three brows. We ended up shooting a nice big bull that year and like the other bulls of that size it had 3 brow tines and ten points.

The other time it made a difference and we would’ve been wrong was this little spike fork we saw. My partner knocked it over because he had a limited entry tag for any bull and the moose was definitely 1.5 years old but 3 points on both sides. It’s pretty hard to judge from 2-300 yards out.

[Norwestalta]

Hoping not to derail your thread but how many moose are wasted because upon ground inspection they don't have the points?
I'm sure that moose get wasted here as well with the 4" antler regulation and some maybe confusing a bull with a cow and vice versa.

[HappyJack]

A lot of moose taken as 10 pointers don't meet the grade. At least I've seen quite a few dead ones with nubs on the antlers that sure look like points to the average joe, but aren't longer than they are wide at the base as per the regulations. It's far easier to determine if they have a tri palm and really what I look for.

[Walking Buffalo]

I stumbled across this today. I’m not sure if it’s been posted here before, but still a good discussion item.

https://www.all-about-moose.com/moose-antlers.html

This conversation has come up at moose camp a few times. The one time it actually made a difference was the one year we went up to fort Nelson looking for a ten point or better. After some discussion about counting points we kind of made a loose agreement if the bull has a full palm and some brow tines he probably has either ten points or three on the brow. Out of the bulls we’ve seen that have a full palm and brow tines they’ve all passed as a ten point or three brows. We ended up shooting a nice big bull that year and like the other bulls of that size it had 3 brow tines and ten points.

The other time it made a difference and we would’ve been wrong was this little spike fork we saw. My partner knocked it over because he had a limited entry tag for any bull and the moose was definitely 1.5 years old but 3 points on both sides. It’s pretty hard to judge from 2-300 yards out.

That loose agreement is completely irresponsible.




Please stumble across some research on antler phenotypes and polymorphism.
The article you linked even touches on the topic.

[KodiakHntr]

You guys got lucky with the big bull you shot, nothing more. Pretty irresponsible to shoot an animal that carries a tine requirement based on "he has big paddles".

If there is a tine requirement, you count tines. Period.

[Bustercluck]

You guys got lucky with the big bull you shot, nothing more. Pretty irresponsible to shoot an animal that carries a tine requirement based on "he has big paddles".

If there is a tine requirement, you count tines. Period.

Thats completely my decision and not yours. If I shoot something illegal I have to suffer the consequences. This thread wasn’t started to discuss ethics. I was more interested how many people have seen full palm bulls with brow tines that wouldn’t make the ten point or better requirements, or is it pretty safe to say that if you see a bull fitting this description it’s going to pass. Like I said, out of the bulls I’ve seen with a full palm and brow tines they all would’ve passed for ten point or better.

Do you have something positive to add to the conversation?

[KodiakHntr]

Thats completely my decision and not yours. If I shoot something illegal I have to suffer the consequences. This thread wasn’t started to discuss ethics. I was more interested how many people have seen full palm bulls with brow tines that wouldn’t make the ten point or better requirements, or is it pretty safe to say that if you see a bull fitting this description it’s going to pass. Like I said, out of the bulls I’ve seen with a full palm and brow tines they all would’ve passed for ten point or better.

Do you have something positive to add to the conversation?

I did have something positive to say. You got LUCKY. Don't do it again. That's as positive as it is going to get from me.

If I had to hazard a guess I would say that living in the North with the amount of bull moose I see every year I pass on 5-10 legal bulls every year. And yes, I have seen mature bulls with full paddles that do not have ten countable tines or 3 brow palm tines. I have found 2 mature bulls shot and left in the last 2 falls from guys like you who have thought that "he looked legal" when he was standing there.

You don't want to discuss ethics, then don't start a thread where you bring up your lack of ethics. Pretty simple. Every week there is a thread on here where people are talking about the lack of moose in the province and you come on and start a thread about shooting moose that may not be legal and you don't want to talk about ethics???

If there is a tine requirement to make an animal legal then you count tines. To do anything else shows a lack of ethics, and even more importantly it shows a lack of respect for the animal regardless of your intent to "the suffer consequences if you shoot something illegal". There are ALWAYS bulls out there that will not meet the full legal requirement despite looking like they are fully mature.

No different than shooting a short ram because he "looks like he was mature so he must be 8" and then finding out that he was a 7 year old. Or seeing a big framed muley to find out that he is a massive 3x3.

What makes YOU an adequate judge of what a full paddle looks like, to decide what a fully mature bull looks like? Are you a moose biologist who has studied the physical make up of bull moose antler configurations by age across their habitat? Where have your studies been published? Or are you just another asshole who is willing to let your desire to kill a moose override the requirements to ensure a bull is legal before you pull the trigger and you are looking for validation from other hunters here for your choices?

Because the way you have the original post worded, what you are looking for is for guys to say "yeah, go ahead and don't count tines before you pull the trigger if he looks big, we do it too, its ok.'

[quadrakid]

Thats completely my decision and not yours. If I shoot something illegal I have to suffer the consequences. This thread wasn’t started to discuss ethics. I was more interested how many people have seen full palm bulls with brow tines that wouldn’t make the ten point or better requirements, or is it pretty safe to say that if you see a bull fitting this description it’s going to pass. Like I said, out of the bulls I’ve seen with a full palm and brow tines they all would’ve passed for ten point or better.

Do you have something positive to add to the conversation?

With all do respect,if you are going to admit to doing something that is basically illegal,shooting a moose before counting points based on a hunch that it will be legal,you should be ready for a little flack. Interesting article.

[NMO]

"It’s pretty hard to judge from 2-300 yards out." Better binos or a spotting scope will solve that. Generally at 2-300 yds the moose aren't aware of much if you did your part. Obviously bumping one changes that.

http://flash.lakeheadu.ca/~arodgers/Alces/moose_bell.pdf

Loose agreements aside, Moose Bells are a good general age indicator (if you care about harvesting the most mature bull you can) and this is a pretty in-depth illustrated description of that. Through a guides eyes, it's better to pass a 60" young bull and shoot a 50" old bull, and most clients are with that program. IMO shooting too much of the young population is what has hurt Ontario's moose in a lot of areas.

[eatram]

Have I seen bulls with full palms and brow tunes that weren’t legal? Yes Sir, I have. Enough to make you second guess any fully mature moose. I have spent 15-30 days hunting in their forests, every year for 20 something years. Two years ago, I watched a 50”er for 30 minutes. 600 yards away. I was waiting for him to come in as I knew he had the criteria for legality. Swarovskis revealed (after a head turn), that his third point on the brow was on the wrong side of the deepest bay. Not legal.....

For your sake, count the points. Not just once. Once you make that first mistake, hunting will NEVER be the same again. This response was fully intended to be heard as a respectful response, not a judgement or condemnation