The Best All Round Breed

[huntingfamily]

When I was a kid we used to hunt southern alberta, mainly for pheasants when it used to be good.
My Dad always had british (aka english) labs so that's what I grew up hunting behind.
I can vividly remember running as fast as I could behind Dad's dogs as it was chasing after those runners. The hope was that you could stay close enough for a shot if the bird eventually got up. At the time it was just what you had to do at times.

I eventually got into versatiles and I find with proper exposure and training they will not chase but rather creep along pointing off and on to maintain contact but not pressure enough to flush. Some have that caution naturally but not all.
The other thing I've seen in some of my dogs is the ability to adapt by running around and in front of the runners, pinning them until we get near. The dogs I've had do this weren't young but had experience.

We also hunt snowshoe hares in the winter and that really helps them develop their use of nose by tracking in the bush.

The more exposure and variety of game your dog's get to hunt, the better the skills they develop.

I agree with 835's comments about the differences in a dog's abilities and being able to adapt with experience. Well said.

[ACB]

I couldn't agree with you more 835, once a dog gets really good unfortunately most times their old. When their young and they've been started and trained on pigeons and bird preserve's with pheasants/chukars their just starting to get the idea. Their first times out for wild pheasants can be quite humbling for a dog that aced the pigeon field and bird preserves. But whats fun to watch is like a friend of mine calls the light going on a dog, when they figure it. But some dogs the light will never go on and others it will happen quickly and others it may take a couple or few seasons. I had a M. BL. Lab that took a couple seasons, but when the light went on he was almost relentless on the scent until he figured it out, he was a trailing machine. There's no substitute for experience with wild pheasants.

[wrenchhead]

Well I'm going to get laughed out of here but after having labs all my life, i now have a 'labradoodler' type of beast. He has hair quite similar to a setter, color and wave. His nose is better and has almost twice the stamina of any lab iv had. Hes 3 now and we have had 2 successful bird seasons so far and continues to improve. And the best part is his temperament.....always looking to please and never has shown any aggression towards other dogs or people.

[Spy]

That is the thing with Dogs. If you use them, and I mean use them. And the dog is smart, they find a way. Your Vizsla was hunted, and it figured it out. There are a few problems with peoples opinions and dogs for birds...
you cant compare a dog that is hunted hard to another dog that is only jumping out of a truck to go pick up a dead ditch chicken. You cant be a guy who says " My poodle is a great flusher" and expect someone who hunts birds full time to not laugh at you. Dogs are designed to do different things and hunters have different requirements for them as well as different "levels" of hunt in them..

That is part of why Dog threads are always good!

Totally agree best dog I ever had was a Weimaraner and Dalmation X. Would track wounded game, point retrieve downed birds and small game all day long + best family dog ever.. Ive had pointers labs Doodles all hunted but not like my boy Spy did. So when someone tells me you need a pure bread bla bla bla, I just laugh at them because they know **** all....

[jagen mit DDrs]

For the once in a blue moon hunter it doesn't matter if your dog is a Heinz 57 but if you are an avid hunter and you are going to buy a hunting dog that to pursue your passion then why would you chance it to buy unknown quality?You will rarely get what you are looking for and by the time you realise that your pup doesn't have what it takes you have money and time invested in it without any return.Granted,there might be the odd pup that's pretty good but your chance of finding "the one" is up to chance.You can't make a silk purse out of sows ears!That's why pups are tested in various tests at various ages to see if the dog is up to breed standard.
Spy,what are you basing your dogs performance on?Unless you are have a standard you can base your dogs performance on,you have nothing to go by.
I hear many times every year,my dog got a great nose,retrieves everything and points like a hot damn.....only for the owners to find out that the dog is mediocre at best.
Rainer

[Foxton Gundogs]

For the once in a blue moon hunter it doesn't matter if your dog is a Heinz 57 but if you are an avid hunter and you are going to buy a hunting dog that to pursue your passion then why would you chance it to buy unknown quality?You will rarely get what you are looking for and by the time you realise that your pup doesn't have what it takes you have money and time invested in it without any return.Granted,there might be the odd pup that's pretty good but your chance of finding "the one" is up to chance.You can't make a silk purse out of sows ears!That's why pups are tested in various tests at various ages to see if the dog is up to breed standard.
Spy,what are you basing your dogs performance on?Unless you are have a standard you can base your dogs performance on,you have nothing to go by.
I hear many times every year,my dog got a great nose,retrieves everything and points like a hot damn.....only for the owners to find out that the dog is mediocre at best.
Rainer

So true, Rainer. We who know about what standard a good dog is supposed to be held to also know what a good finished dog should be, regardless of their chosen breed they have standards to compare to. What gets me are those who have no clue what a really good dog should be and what hidden dangers lie in untested gene pools yet think those of us who have a lifetime of breeding, training, competing and hunting over really good PB dogs don't know of what we speak they are only deluding themselves and doing a disservice to their dog. People like yourself, Lab Guy, Kinderdoggin to name a few, know their stuff no matter what anyone may think. Anyone who's dog does enough to make them happy then that's fine but to ridicule those that have been there and done that many times then that's just ignorance on their part and betrays their lack of concrete knowledge of gundogs.

[labguy]

For the once in a blue moon hunter it doesn't matter if your dog is a Heinz 57 but if you are an avid hunter and you are going to buy a hunting dog that to pursue your passion then why would you chance it to buy unknown quality?You will rarely get what you are looking for and by the time you realise that your pup doesn't have what it takes you have money and time invested in it without any return.Granted,there might be the odd pup that's pretty good but your chance of finding "the one" is up to chance.You can't make a silk purse out of sows ears!That's why pups are tested in various tests at various ages to see if the dog is up to breed standard.
Spy,what are you basing your dogs performance on?Unless you are have a standard you can base your dogs performance on,you have nothing to go by.
I hear many times every year,my dog got a great nose,retrieves everything and points like a hot damn.....only for the owners to find out that the dog is mediocre at best.
Rainer

Its all subjective. What might be the best hunting dog ever to one person might not measure up to another persons standards that are based on years and years of experience with many different dogs. One persons "dog of a lifetime" could very well be another persons washout.

Ill say one more thing about testing for breed standards in sporting dogs of all the different breeds. There's lots of variations to those standards depending on who the judges are that are doing the testing. Terrain, lighting conditions, scenting conditions, favoritism and dumb shit luck play a huge part in all testing.

Ive hunted with dogs who were supposed to be the pinnacle of their particular breed after being tested in supposedly THE most rigorous venues in the world, that couldn't find a steak on a dinner plate in a real life hunting situation.

Botton line is if you are happy with the dog you have it matters shit what anyone else thinks. In almost all cases, the more experience a dog has the better it will become.

[jagen mit DDrs]

Most pointing dogs here are "trained"to natural ability and their owners think they have the best dog.nor realizing that natural ability is only the corner stone you base your future training on.
When you look at HBC and people want to train their dogs but can't manage to rustle up a gettogether for training then I can only surmise how much training goes into the average pooch.
I agree with Foxton and Labguy that testing is not a substitute for hunting but if testing is conducted as a real Hunt test,it will give an indication of a dogs ability in the field.Don't test for scores but for the respective standard,the ecpectation of the breed.

Rainer

[Spy]

My dog ran with the best dogs in the world and out worked them hands down, did I luck out absolutely. I believe all dogs find you, you don’t need to go looking. My point been you don’t need a purebred to do the job it’s all in the training unless your dog has NO natural ability. Purebreds can also be duds.

[Spy]

Well I'm going to get laughed out of here but after having labs all my life, i now have a 'labradoodler' type of beast. He has hair quite similar to a setter, color and wave. His nose is better and has almost twice the stamina of any lab iv had. Hes 3 now and we have had 2 successful bird seasons so far and continues to improve. And the best part is his temperament.....always looking to please and never has shown any aggression towards other dogs or people.

Bingo great dogs with natural abilities from two breeds, can’t go wrong the instinct is there.