New Law For Region 4 EK..

[Walking Buffalo]

I see why many like yourself think it is at least a positive step....I get it.
It cant hurt or make it worse.
But, in the end "what is it going to help".

Deer aren't humans.
When AIDS came out, you could tell people to put it in a wrapper, or don't be stupid.
This cant really be applied to deer or by just saying okay, no more treats for you.
It's still going to spread

This reminds me of how Saskatchewan handles CWD.
Gov went against the advice of their Biologists and caved under heavy lobbying by outfitters (95% for American clients) and the Game farm canned "hunting" organizations.
Baiting continued, herd density reductions were stopped, and CWD spread like a prairie wildfire. With only very limited testing (thanks Sask Gov) CWD rates in areas are over 50%.

Here in Alberta, without baiting, and during the years of herd density suppression, CWD was not spreading into Alberta, but was contained to the near the Sask border, infection rates were 1-2%.
Our containment measures WERE working!

Then lobbying pushed to end the herd density suppression, the greatest effort to do so was from the Outfitting community.
Once herds were allowed to grow, so did the rate of infection and spread of the disease.


But go ahead, keep singing, Lalalalalallaaaaa…..


I sense a different issue at hand here. Many seem to be apposed to ANY change.
I get the frustration from recent changes, the feeling of being hit and run on....
But don't let that get in the way of changes that really do need to happen for the sake of Wildlife.
This is NOT an Hunter issue, this is a Wildlife Health concern.

However there was scientific proof that certain diseases could spread from llamas and elpacas to sheep..

There is no such evidence regarding ungulates and baiting

There are plenty of studies showing evidence of increased disease transmission between ungulates due to baiting.

I agree, there is a lack of studies directly researching CWD transmission and baiting.
But they are not really necessary, Other research applies.

[Walking Buffalo]

For those that are interested in how other jurisdictions are discussing the next generation of CWD management policy,
Fully read the Wyoming Draft CWD management plan and discussions.

This goes far beyond what is being pubically discussed in BC.
An insight to a possible future.



https://wgfd.wyo.gov/WGFD/media/cont...lan_113019.pdf

[Bugle M In]

Walking Buff,

I don't have an agenda.
Actually, I have never used baiting as a hunting technique and actually switch the hunting channel when I watch bbear hunts using it etc.
Not my thing, same goes for Xbows and ATVs, don't use or own either.
Have a Cam, never hung on a tree for a second since I have owned it.

This is the New Era of the BAN my friend!
We have a GBear BAN, but is that sound management???...nope.
We have ever increasing ATV BAN, but what good is it if poachers and FN have access on all those extra roads.
(real solution is tear them up and restrict atv for all to roads only)
We have a SCOPE BAN proposed (but will fail, but the next round will be a full on XBOW BAN like Alberta I predict).
Then there are the rumor's of the TROPHY HUNT BAN (bye bye GO's in the EK if that happens).

Me, just I guy who has always hunted with a rifle on foot or mtn bike, nothing less. nothing more!
No affiliation with any Org.
Mostly because every Org I have seen has in part, their own itinerary, not a general goal.

And WORST OF ALL, nothing has ever worked so far because it has never addressed the real factor to game # declines in BC.
But keep trying to come up with new hunting proposals that will, it's worked so well so far!

[Bugle M In]

Truth is (In a simplistic form), our hunting history goes little like this:

We had an Era of Anything Goes:

As long as it had 4 legs, you were good to go (2 legged was a no no)
But eventually people did smarten up and realized this wouldn't work with an increasing population.

The Era of Reduction:
Shorter Seasons, and limits on harvests came along (all good).
Trying to incorporate a NA Management Theory.

But, this wasn't enough, because some areas just get pounded by hunters because they are just in close proximity to large communities.
enter the:

Era of Limitations (that's right, the LEH).
Another okay proposal that should have made a world of difference, but has it?

But nope, something still isn't working??

Ah yes, the Era of Restriction!
Thins like "No vehicles allowed", as these area were only intended for those with horses and planes.
And yet, even those areas still have no game?

So, hey, here's the NEW PHILOSOPHY!

THE ERA OFF THE BAN!
GBEAR BANNED
BAIT BANNED
XBOW, (soon to be BANNED me thinks in BOS)
ATV BANNED (starting to be a popular trend!)
TROPHY HUNT (possibly BANNED if Heyman gets another term!, possible anyways).

What other BANS are in the works???
Who knows? but I am sure more are to come in the next 2 to 3 Regulation Proposal Cycles.

Funny, a long History of "taking steps to create game" thru the process of REGULATION.
End score....still declining game!

COMMON DENOMINATOR????????
All focus to create more game has been conducted by REGULATING HUNTERS, in one form or another.
Everyone else goes on their merry way.

NOW TELL ME WHERE WRONG?????
Give me evidence to support it however WB!
Because I have most of BC's wildlife issues summed up in the above words.

CWD can not and will not be eradicated or controlled by hunters.
BUT HEY, lets go for it.
After all, doesn't affect me in the least and my hunting.

I just feel bad for folks like H47, the OP, who likes to hunt that way at times.
And, lets not BS it, this Ban is for R4 NOW, BUT, will be a PROVINCE WIDE BAIT BAN soon.

But again, no other factions/industries will be held to the same standards.
Yup, going to work out perfectly.

[horshur]

Bud...its going to effect your hunting...the number 1 tool in the shed is game densities..low densities low transmission rates...that's the science. The truth.
Low densities means poor hunting..which is the general consensus of BCs current state. Guess you all can thank the loggers, wolves and first nations for that..lol

[Walking Buffalo]

Walking Buff,

I don't have an agenda.

Never claimed or thought you did.

As I suggested, there is a groundswell of opposition to Any change, regardless of what it is.
Not necessarily due to the reasons for the change, just that it is a change....
Your last couple of posts reflect this perspective.
I get it.... many have had enough.

[Bugle M In]

Bud...its going to effect your hunting...the number 1 tool in the shed is game densities..low densities low transmission rates...that's the science. The truth.
Low densities means poor hunting..which is the general consensus of BCs current state. Guess you all can thank the loggers, wolves and first nations for that..lol

Yup, that goes without say!
Also, Saskatchewan is way closer to ground 0 then Alberta when CWD showed up in the States.

So yes, we can keep our low game densities, benefits slowing CWD transmission.
So, we can all call it a day, and accept poor hunting for generations to come.
Yes, CWD was the last thing we needed with the said above issues already.

Going to be interesting to see what kind of shovel someone comes up with to digs out of this hole!???
Maybe it is just easier to keep the bullies like many of us at bay, and just close off hunting altogether.
Way easier.

[Bugle M In]

Never claimed or thought you did.

As I suggested, there is a groundswell of opposition to Any change, regardless of what it is.
Not necessarily due to the reasons for the change, just that it is a change....
Your last couple of posts reflect this perspective.
I get it.... many have had enough.

I just don't want everyone to look at my rants as trying to be a bully or stop people from focusing on some serious issues, and we have a
ton of them.
The "many have had enough" is definitely the category I am in.
I feel like we are going at it all alone and have been for years.
And even if we make a few gains, the FN are going to bury us anyways unless we come to some kind of truce going forward.

I just said this to another member in a pm:

I am told we have a lot of brilliant minds in BC, trying to make things better.
But you can have a room full of brilliant people and just end up with stupid results anyways.
Best Example:
Look at NASA, tons of brilliant minds there!
Yet, they had space capsules burn, shuttles blow up, and the list goes on.

But, you know what made them successful???
They had "Government Support" to continue on and make it happen, to achieve success.

It Means:

A Brilliant Mind is USELESS without the TOOLS IN HAND.'
One without the other, is useless.
That is our current state of affairs'.
That's my final summation!

[Bugle M In]

Heres a question to those that support the Bait Ban in an effort to reduce CWD transmission.
I am informed that CWD actually infects MD BUCKS the most, followed by MD Doe, then WT (cant remember the order there?).
So, if that is the case, ALONG with the fact that a reduction in cwd can also be obtained by "thinning herds" etc.

Does that mean we will see a lifting of the 4pt MD restriction back down to any buck wherever and whenever a 4 pt restriction is
now in place???
You know, it will thin the herds out more by doing that...wouldn't it???
Also a fight against cwd tactic, don't you think?

Yes, I didn't think that will happen, but just wanted to point that out.

[IronNoggin]

The government website has been flooded with so many negative responses to their proposal listings, it has been taken down for "maintenance" purposes.



Stay Tuned. Will let you know when it's back up...


Cheers - Nog