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Thread: Lets Talk about Road Acces

  1. #141
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Monashee Mountains
    Posts
    34

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    if you’re not convinced that roads are an issue, and the province requires more areas free of industry roads, watch this video, maybe it will help you understand.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VVY3gj...ature=youtu.be

    who are the real killers?

  2. #142
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    3,775

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    Sadly, it isn't just road access when it comes to the environment and it's concerns.
    Everyone, meaning government and industry like to talk about it as if they are concerned but the truth is, in the end,
    industry always wins out.
    It's like when there is talk about the "new management plan", and that "all parties/interests" will be involved in the discussions.
    IT's all good on paper, but the truth is, special interests is just another word for "lobbyists" who are only there to make
    sure they are not loosing out.
    Which is true of all who are invited, industry worried about losing jobs, and FN wanting more of the land under their control and hunters wanting to make sure they have more to hunt.
    Its just that some of those interest groups have lobbyist who carry cash to make sure they get what they want.
    Truth is, we are not much better than anywhere else on the planet when it comes to taking care of the environment.
    We just aren't doing it in a way that will make it better for future generations, or at least in a way that they can enjoy
    things to the same capacity as previous generations.
    I don't hold my breath thinking things will change anymore.
    If things don't change, we hunters will be the first ones out of the scenario.
    Industry will just slow down when there is nothing left for them to harvest as far as resources.
    Seems like the only way to protect anything is to turn it into a Park.
    They don't want to change unless they absolutely have to change.
    And even if that happens, it will take several decades for things to come back.

    I recently just watched a couple of documentaries, the plastic ocean and another on a river being poisoned in the States, and you would think that in the States, more would be done when things are found out, and thus rectified.
    In the end, the industries lobbyists just manage to find a way for government to basically sweep it under the rug.

    In the end, it really is left up to the individual to make the difference.
    Something to think about.

  3. #143
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Kelowna
    Posts
    840

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    Quote Originally Posted by Bugle M In View Post
    Sadly, it isn't just road access when it comes to the environment and it's concerns.
    Everyone, meaning government and industry like to talk about it as if they are concerned but the truth is, in the end,
    industry always wins out.
    It's like when there is talk about the "new management plan", and that "all parties/interests" will be involved in the discussions.
    IT's all good on paper, but the truth is, special interests is just another word for "lobbyists" who are only there to make
    sure they are not loosing out.
    Which is true of all who are invited, industry worried about losing jobs, and FN wanting more of the land under their control and hunters wanting to make sure they have more to hunt.
    Its just that some of those interest groups have lobbyist who carry cash to make sure they get what they want.
    Truth is, we are not much better than anywhere else on the planet when it comes to taking care of the environment.
    We just aren't doing it in a way that will make it better for future generations, or at least in a way that they can enjoy
    things to the same capacity as previous generations.
    I don't hold my breath thinking things will change anymore.
    If things don't change, we hunters will be the first ones out of the scenario.
    Industry will just slow down when there is nothing left for them to harvest as far as resources.
    Seems like the only way to protect anything is to turn it into a Park.
    They don't want to change unless they absolutely have to change.
    And even if that happens, it will take several decades for things to come back.

    I recently just watched a couple of documentaries, the plastic ocean and another on a river being poisoned in the States, and you would think that in the States, more would be done when things are found out, and thus rectified.
    In the end, the industries lobbyists just manage to find a way for government to basically sweep it under the rug.

    In the end, it really is left up to the individual to make the difference.
    Something to think about.
    I fully agree and the more I have become involved in trying to correct the wrongs or bring awareness to the issues, the more disheartened I become. You only have to go as far as the provincial budget to realize NO ONE
    in government, the very people who can change and make a difference, cares about wildlife or the environment. They will do a little thing here or there as lip service, but that is it. Even the pro environment NDP dedicates single percentage digits in their budget.......shameful. Don't get me started on the DFO..... but I keep trying simply because I feel we need to at least try. Its apparent not many others are willing to..... for those of you who do...kudos to you!
    There was a time I thought all parties that cared for wildlife and habitat conservation could find common ground. I was wrong. Adapt and battle on....

  4. #144
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    140

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    Quote Originally Posted by Seeker View Post
    I fully agree and the more I have become involved in trying to correct the wrongs or bring awareness to the issues, the more disheartened I become. You only have to go as far as the provincial budget to realize NO ONE
    in government, the very people who can change and make a difference, cares about wildlife or the environment. They will do a little thing here or there as lip service, but that is it. Even the pro environment NDP dedicates single percentage digits in their budget.......shameful. Don't get me started on the DFO..... but I keep trying simply because I feel we need to at least try. Its apparent not many others are willing to..... for those of you who do...kudos to you!
    Very well said. We do need to call for change in big industry BC. And embrace it when it comes. Our F&W stand to gain the most. When F&W are doing well thereís plenty of opportunities for all of us. If things stay as they are now everything and everyone loses. Hopefully as hunters and fishermen we can gain enough voice to be heard and understood. We are behind on this subject as many other organizations are moving ahead on this.

  5. #145
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    The Okanagan Valley
    Posts
    1,607

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    As long as there is logging there will be access. As long as there are wild fires there will be access. Deactivating the roads only stops the motor vehicles. The atv owners, and I am an atv owner, will find ways around the deactivation site. How can we stop atv owners from clearing out access roads around deactivation sites when mountain bikers are allowed to construct bike trails with reckless abandon at all elevations? At one site off Arawana road a small excavator was brought in to construct a section of a mountain bike trail.
    We can annihilate all the predators but without habitat the writing is on the wall for the demise of certain wildlife species. Let the wild fires do what they are meant to do in the grand sceme of things and that is to restore habitat. It is short term pain for long term gain. Protect the residential areas but let the wild fires burn burn out with no access created. Selectively log the areas with focus on protecting valuable animal habitat. Protect low elevation winter ranges. Sadly this will never happen as we a too focused on a strong bottom line for logging companies and timber mills and a strong economy.

  6. #146
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    somewhere in time......
    Posts
    2,618

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    The 'new age' foresters with all the letters behind their names and zero logging experience have deemed to take fire out of the equation. Un-burned slash, a few large piles of debris (it took diesel fuel/time) and dead replants because of heat. The slash stays like a moonscape for 3+ years, lots of dry fuel on the ground, no fireweed, no bugs, bees, birds, or bears . . .
    If you don't have the RPF letters behind your name, the 40+ years of bushcraft and logging mean nothing . . .
    Burn the slash, get that cut-block 'working' again . . .
    1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 ​48 48 49 50 ​........

  7. #147
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Posts
    4,368

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    Quote Originally Posted by Seeker View Post
    I fully agree and the more I have become involved in trying to correct the wrongs or bring awareness to the issues, the more disheartened I become. You only have to go as far as the provincial budget to realize NO ONE
    in government, the very people who can change and make a difference, cares about wildlife or the environment. They will do a little thing here or there as lip service, but that is it. Even the pro environment NDP dedicates single percentage digits in their budget.......shameful. Don't get me started on the DFO..... but I keep trying simply because I feel we need to at least try. Its apparent not many others are willing to..... for those of you who do...kudos to you!
    their idea of doing something for the environment is shipping lower mainland garbage to Cash creek

  8. #148
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    In the bush near a lake
    Posts
    5,838

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    Quote Originally Posted by ACE View Post
    The 'new age' foresters with all the letters behind their names and zero logging experience have deemed to take fire out of the equation. Un-burned slash, a few large piles of debris (it took diesel fuel/time) and dead replants because of heat. The slash stays like a moonscape for 3+ years, lots of dry fuel on the ground, no fireweed, no bugs, bees, birds, or bears . . .
    If you don't have the RPF letters behind your name, the 40+ years of bushcraft and logging mean nothing . . .
    Burn the slash, get that cut-block 'working' again . . .
    These changes are another factor that is not helping

  9. #149
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Quesnel
    Posts
    661

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    Quote Originally Posted by ACE View Post
    The 'new age' foresters with all the letters behind their names and zero logging experience have deemed to take fire out of the equation. Un-burned slash, a few large piles of debris (it took diesel fuel/time) and dead replants because of heat. The slash stays like a moonscape for 3+ years, lots of dry fuel on the ground, no fireweed, no bugs, bees, birds, or bears . . .
    If you don't have the RPF letters behind your name, the 40+ years of bushcraft and logging mean nothing . . .
    Burn the slash, get that cut-block 'working' again . . .
    Itís not that easy. Changes to the MoF public policy in 1988 eliminated the forest industryís liability for prescribed burns. Any costs to suppress an escaped fire is on the company or person who started it.

  10. #150
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    3,775

    Re: Lets Talk about Road Acces

    Quote Originally Posted by Walksalot View Post
    As long as there is logging there will be access. As long as there are wild fires there will be access. Deactivating the roads only stops the motor vehicles. The atv owners, and I am an atv owner, will find ways around the deactivation site. How can we stop atv owners from clearing out access roads around deactivation sites when mountain bikers are allowed to construct bike trails with reckless abandon at all elevations? At one site off Arawana road a small excavator was brought in to construct a section of a mountain bike trail.
    We can annihilate all the predators but without habitat the writing is on the wall for the demise of certain wildlife species. Let the wild fires do what they are meant to do in the grand sceme of things and that is to restore habitat. It is short term pain for long term gain. Protect the residential areas but let the wild fires burn burn out with no access created. Selectively log the areas with focus on protecting valuable animal habitat. Protect low elevation winter ranges. Sadly this will never happen as we a too focused on a strong bottom line for logging companies and timber mills and a strong economy.
    I remember hiking in with several guys to a lake one of them used to go to.
    In the meantime, he hadn't realized so much logging happened from the opposite side that we hiked from at the lake.
    We took over an hour to get there.
    Once we got close we could hear a motor.
    Turns out had we hiked from the "logged side", it would have taken less than 15 minutes.

    BUT, what made it worse, was that an ATV guy cut a trail thru the remaining distance to bring a boat in!
    (worst part was, the lake is so small, that he had to constantly keep the motor turn….he just did a big circle!...
    it was just know for big fish, but it was basically a pond!)

    So many times now I have seen ORV users just make their own trails!
    I have seen them up in the kettle valley, in the alpine, where they knew they weren't supposed to be, and argued about
    what defined the border of the closure.

    And that's just ORV's and roads and non road issues.
    Then you have all those "HELI TOURS" going on, especially in the EK.
    Seems to be little regulation there.
    Out goat hunting and then, hey look, half of Japan is up there with Camera's!!
    Or just seeing them hover over peaks where Bighorn are.
    Talk about "stressing out" the wildlife.

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