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Thread: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

  1. #61
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    Jun 2010
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    3,898

    Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    Quote Originally Posted by Ohwildwon View Post
    So, someone posts some good news, that it s not all doom and gloom out there.

    And you turn it around and make it all about yourself.

    Nice
    The thread is on a leading edge mule deer project who's goal is to ultimately help in MD recovery in areas where once robust populations are spiraling downward.
    You post pics of deer shit from an area that has nothing to do about the topic.
    About me?


    I'm all in favor of keeping dangerous weapons out of the hands of fools. Let's start with keyboards and forums. - F L Wright


    Try and be kind to everyone but fear no one. - Ourea


  2. #62
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    Nov 2014
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    west kootenay
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    105

    Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    Quote Originally Posted by Walksalot View Post
    The way the mule deer disappeared goes, in my opinion, far beyond predation. Something had decimated the mule deer population and we had better find out what pretty soon. Had a discussion with a forester and we talked about the economic value of our forest and how logging can enhance habitat but I pointed out the poor buggers need a place to hide. As pointed out subdivisions on lower elevations above the valley bottoms are really impacting their winter ranges. My wife is sick of me commenting at every advertisement for residential subdivisions with spectacular views of the valley.
    yes!! i think you nailed it there @Walksalot....i agree forestry practices can be beneficial...but don't see too many logging companies practicing selective timber harvest...whitetails love that clearcut regrowth though...mulies not so much...habitat loss...it's a shame that as the Okanagan human population continues to grow, so will the decline of mule deer continue...

  3. #63
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    Feb 2007
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    3,423

    Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    The hypothesis needs to be proved rather then promoted...study should be free of bias.
    Not saying your wrong just saying your putting the cart before the horse.

    There are multiple factors just as important that must be considered....and it would be much more useful to problem solve rather then finger point. Hindsight is 20/20...

    like the caribou .remedial actions such setting aside habitat which has already been altered (ie logged) might be useful long term but not so much short term...you cannot put the genie back in the bottle.

    campaigning makes it seem you already made your minds up..study is not even a year along....
    It is well to try and journey ones road and to fight with the air.Man must die! At worst he can die a little sooner." (H Ryder Haggard)

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    In the bush near a lake
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    7,198

    Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    Quote Originally Posted by horshur View Post
    The hypothesis needs to be proved rather then promoted...study should be free of bias.
    Not saying your wrong just saying your putting the cart before the horse.

    There are multiple factors just as important that must be considered....and it would be much more useful to problem solve rather then finger point. Hindsight is 20/20...

    like the caribou .remedial actions such setting aside habitat which has already been altered (ie logged) might be useful long term but not so much short term...you cannot put the genie back in the bottle.

    campaigning makes it seem you already made your minds up..study is not even a year along....
    Could not agree more and this would be the best thing for credibility of the study(and future studies) and mule deer themselves

    One piece of evidence is often not enough to reach a factual conclusion and that is why a study is done. I could debate with facts one point that keeps getting hinted at but that does nothing for the out come of the study. It’s nice to hear factual data that is found during this study though

    I will place bets their is multiple factors at play with the decline. It would be a shame to see things groomed towards 1 issue and others ignored. It would be nice to see this study end with results that highlight all possible factors impacting mule deer and the facts used to reach the conclusion.

    It’s great to hear this study is being done but it will be even better if it concludes with non bias facts and conclusion

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    BC
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    2,291

    Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    ^^^^agree completely... this is critical, otherwise may just be a means to preconceived agenda. Decline may well be largely due to predation and yet if study not thorough enough with significant sample size could easily be spun to be habitat loss. Need enough data over significantly long time to start to see trends and draw conclusions. Doing so prematurely would not be helpful and defeat purpose entirely. I could see this taking a decade or so. If heavy predation is factor that should be obvious much sooner. If is predation may well still be partially related to habitat loss, but at least will be able to start addressing possible short term solutions while the study continues and then monitor how those solutions start to impact survival over the longer term.
    Last edited by northof49; 03-09-2019 at 11:46 AM.

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Squamish
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    481

    Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    In my eyes it seems like we know what the problems are.

    Humans destruction of habitat/road access. Which causes both 4 and 2 legged predators to be much more efficient, both due to travelling corridors and high concentrations of deer in pockets which make it easier for predators to seemingly pillage ungulates. The wolves are going to find where the deer HAVE to be, which that area is getting smaller and smaller.

    Short term - cull predators, seems to be the only solution (in my eyes)
    Long term - which should start immediately. Habitat enhancement, make mining and forestry accountable for restoration projects. Stop development on prime wintering grounds. Then maybe it can turn from culling to manage predators.

    What can you do as a hunter, at least short term? Kill any wolf or coyote you see. You hear a pack of wolves howling go from elk hunting to wolf hunting. (Which I'm guilty of just moving on to where I think wolves won't be). Carry a cougar, bobcat and lynx tag. And what I think is most important, go out and shoot some bears. I'll probably get some flack for this, but whatever a problem is a problem. Who cares about sex when it comes to bears, if the idea is to lower numbers. As long as it's legal with no Cubs and predator management is your priority it shouldn't be an issue. Same with sexing a cat, If i ever cross one with no kittens, it probably won't be walking around much longer. This probably sounds cold but there is an issue in this province.

    Hopefully I'll be able to follow my own advice this spring when it comes to bears, as that seems to me the only real impactful thing hunters can easily accomplish. If your an accomplished wolf or cat Hunter than great but let's be honest that isn't too realistic.

  7. #67
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    181

    Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    Quote Originally Posted by horshur View Post
    The hypothesis needs to be proved rather then promoted...study should be free of bias.
    Not saying your wrong just saying your putting the cart before the horse.

    There are multiple factors just as important that must be considered....and it would be much more useful to problem solve rather then finger point. Hindsight is 20/20...

    like the caribou .remedial actions such setting aside habitat which has already been altered (ie logged) might be useful long term but not so much short term...you cannot put the genie back in the bottle.

    campaigning makes it seem you already made your minds up..study is not even a year along....
    i along with many will keep my opinions to myself. Time will tell on this study if much money and time are being spent studying the obvious. One smoking gun will not likely be found as we all can agree on this being a complex matter.
    I do recall one very important quote that will stand the test of time.
    “When we take care of the land we take care of everything”
    it is my observation and may others we’ve done a very piss poor job taking care of the land in BC. I’m guilty of this as well.

  8. #68
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    Sep 2009
    Location
    Port Alberni
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    14,203

    Question Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    Quote Originally Posted by RobU View Post
    i will keep my opinions to myself.
    Why don't you actually try living up to that statement for once??
    Would be somewhat refreshing.

    BTW, How's that CWD paper coming along, and how long before we can all see it posted here?

    Wondering...
    Nog
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVNNhzkJ-UU&feature=related

    Egotistical, Self Centered, Son of a Bitch Killer that Doesn't Play Well With Others.

    Guess he got to Know me

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    181

    Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    Quote Originally Posted by IronNoggin View Post
    Why don't you actually try living up to that statement for once??
    Would be somewhat refreshing.

    BTW, How's that CWD paper coming along, and how long before we can all see it posted here?

    Wondering...
    Nog
    Your not gonna get anything accomplished sniping at me. I could however send you a hurt feelings report to fill out.

  10. #70
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    763

    Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan

    Ok I have seen in many areas the MD population decline drastically even the past 7 years. However I did hunt an area this year that held a very healthy population seeing over 14 bucks and close to 80 different does and fawns in a 15 km range. I would love for the bios to go study there except I dont want anyone knowing about this spot

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