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Thread: Sustenance hunt?????

  1. #41
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    ????? Where in the laws does it say they can only hunt for sustenance? I am not aware of this.

    Also, I know they have the right for commercial harvest. They are allowed to hunt/harvest animals to sustain themselves financially. That means if the gentleman sells the bighorn ram horns for money then he is certainly in his rights to do so.

  2. #42
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    yes sustenance...as in sustaining a fat bank account...doh!

  3. #43
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbob View Post
    FN have the right to hunt the way they want, we cannot really dictate what is right or wrong for them. Is it ok for them to shoot a 5 yr old ram? what about a ewe?

    Anyways, the only issue/concern that can be addressed with FN hunting is to ensure the species can handle it. If a species is declining or not healthy enough to support hunting then FN or anyone else does not have the right to hunt them. I would be onboard criticizing a hunt that was threatening a species but I am not going to criticize an FN because he shot a big animal and put in the effort to do it, actually more power to him.

    We get mad that FN's drive around in their trucks shooting immature animals and now we are getting mad that they are putting in the effort and hunting hard to take a mature specimen. Seems like a lot of hate no matter what the situation is.
    What you have stated here is at best a broad interpretation of FN rights. FN have said numerous time that they are the keepers of the land and respect all of nature. Fair enough. If you are going to talk the talk, then walk the walk. Also, they may have the right, they also have a responsibility in my mind to lead by example. Hunting seasons are set for a reason. Conservation and fair chase being two of the objectives. It is very easy to hunt outside a prescribed season and especially the rut, and be successful. But with species like sheep, which are a species of concern, biologists limit hunting activities during the rut, because these animals are so vulnerable.

    As to the sustenance discussion, I have heard it interpreted that "Sustenance" does not necessarily mean hunting or fishing for food, it can also mean hunting to selling game to live off of. Sad but true. Either way the act of taking game out of season truly sheds light on the character of some people, in my opinion.

  4. #44
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    Jimmy Bob trying to get the boys going...looks like its already done like others have said people are butthurt when immature animals are shot and but hurt when crankers are shot...pretty safe to say no matter what fn harvest people are gonna b butthurt and rightfully so....

  5. #45
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbob View Post
    ????? Where in the laws does it say they can only hunt for sustenance? I am not aware of this.

    Also, I know they have the right for commercial harvest. They are allowed to hunt/harvest animals to sustain themselves financially. That means if the gentleman sells the bighorn ram horns for money then he is certainly in his rights to do so.
    I am no expert but I did not think FN have the right to sell game

  6. #46
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    Quote Originally Posted by VLD43 View Post
    What you have stated here is at best a broad interpretation of FN rights. FN have said numerous time that they are the keepers of the land and respect all of nature. Fair enough. If you are going to talk the talk, then walk the walk. Also, they may have the right, they also have a responsibility in my mind to lead by example. Hunting seasons are set for a reason. Conservation and fair chase being two of the objectives. It is very easy to hunt outside a prescribed season and especially the rut, and be successful. But with species like sheep, which are a species of concern, biologists limit hunting activities during the rut, because these animals are so vulnerable.

    As to the sustenance discussion, I have heard it interpreted that "Sustenance" does not necessarily mean hunting or fishing for food, it can also mean hunting to selling game to live off of. Sad but true. Either way the act of taking game out of season truly sheds light on the character of some people, in my opinion.
    If a herd cannot support any harvesting then I am 100% against ANYBODY that kills one. No one has a right to threaten the viability of a species, laws also back that up. If the argument against this ram hunt was that the population cannot support it that then I am fully onboard with that, BUT that was not the argument.

  7. #47
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Wild one View Post
    I am no expert but I did not think FN have the right to sell game
    Nope, as far as I know they cant sell things like antlers/horns.
    The FN who took the world record Rosie a few years ago out of the Pitt tried to sell it.
    Someone stopped him (not sure who?)
    Now it just rots in the backyard I have been told.

  8. #48
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbob View Post
    If a herd cannot support any harvesting then I am 100% against ANYBODY that kills one. No one has a right to threaten the viability of a species, laws also back that up. If the argument against this ram hunt was that the population cannot support it that then I am fully onboard with that, BUT that was not the argument.
    I think your missing the point somewhat. Aside from any conservation concerns, it is a question of Ethics and responsible actions. I like yourself, have the ability to hunt anytime I like, but we both abide by the rules (laws), and only hunt at prescribed times of the year. As I stated in an earlier post, if your going to advertise yourself and your community as conservationists, you had better follow through, or you will be seen as the hypocrite you truly are, and suffer the condemnation of your peers. I believe this is exactly what you are seeing by many who are posting here. Further more using the excuse that it is a traditional right established over generations to hunt anytime you like, may have worked in the past. With habitat loss and diminishing wildlife populations as they presently are, hunting outside established seasons is unsustainable and will lead to loss of any hereditary right as game populations will not withstand the pressure.

  9. #49
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bugle M In View Post
    Nope, as far as I know they cant sell things like antlers/horns.
    The FN who took the world record Rosie a few years ago out of the Pitt tried to sell it.
    Someone stopped him (not sure who?)
    Now it just rots in the backyard I have been told.
    They can sell, court cases have upheld this. Tricky to sell game meat though that has not been processed by a government inspected facility. Also, the government can restrict who possess wild game. So the FN can sell but you might not be able to own/possess it. However, some courts have said that even this can infringe on FN rights.

    All of this is not black and white though. Some provinces are different, some FN have treaties signed, and some have no treaties at all so it makes things convoluted.

  10. #50
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    Re: Sustenance hunt?????

    Quote Originally Posted by MattB View Post
    As far as sheep go, at least it was a mature ram and not a younger ram or ewe. If a first nations person wants to take a sheep why not shoot a mature ram?
    WHY ?? should ANY first nations person get to harvest any animal then in a legal hunting season witha a legal hunting licence and tag ?? What makes First Nations better then any one else born and raised here ? Getting Pretty ***en Tired of this Bullsh*t ! RJ

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