Another EK Elk Hunt Down the Tubes

[LBM]

Hey LBM, how are you, I was surprised you hadn't chimed in til now!
Yup, spoke to a local, even closer to the area then yourself in town.
There is one nice 6pt for sure in there, and saw where they came out of from the high country, and know where they ended up (atleast at that time).
But, its a far cry from the game #'s it once was up there.
And, those elk only came out of one of the 3 main valleys in there.
I never said the area was completely void of elk, but the #'s are way down in there for sure.

As for Wolves and our discussion earlier this year, yup, would have to agree, there was no sign of them whatsoever.
Not sure if that is a good thing or not????
At least if they are around, you know they have a food source available.
Cougars were also not seen in there as well this time.
Moose are doing well , for what it is worth, but will never be a GOS ever again for them.
The one thing that did look promising is the amount of MD sign, which seems to be growing over the past 3 years.

What is funny however, is you do take the time to say "elk are there, or game is there", but in other posts you say
"The game will never be like it was before"???
That humans have destroyed it?

I get the human factor, and all accounts, but I will never just point a finger at hunters and say they "shot it to shit".
Even the local from town who its all the areas, all the time, on mtn bike says he is concerned as well.
His feeling it is "over hunting", thus the "shot to shit ek" comment he made, or as he says "the locals call it".

I have no reason to believe this was or has been the case, especially when you factor in the countless miles of Road Restrictions in all those watersheds, and by the time they get out of there, the season is closed.
As for what happens after the season, poaching etc, I doubt it is any more problematic then any where else in the province, atleast from the "evidence" point of view.

Zone X does however correlate to the right time frame for the decline in #'s from my thoughts, and wolves have always been up there, but maybe it was a slow death, that took years to show up, and why many, even the studies, suggest elk are being pushed down low, and not returning back up to the high country come spring.

Might also explain the correlation between elk being too numerous down low quickly, and why the locals wanted them Culled?

Either way, messy situation now.
But blaming hunters wont fix the problem, but carry on.

Nothing to chime in about just the same old stuff from you.
This is nothing new game numbers have been dropping in various areas of the EK for years many have brought this up before
and were told there is no issue, you your self were in that group on some instances.
Yes there is elk and other game in there and it will never be like it was before, and yes humans are a big factor or cause of the decline.
Yet you then but blame on the cow seasons, and say moose season could not handle general season.
So will say it again you don't have a clue what goes on in there the rest of the year other then the 10 days your there.
You want to believe what the outfitter, tourist operator, and your ex CO buddy tell you that's your choice.

[LBM]

Nope, don't think you are trying to piss me off.

Take #3.
I know of a few guys doing that (I may not know exactly where they have them, but I have an idea where the area is),
and they are very disappointed with what they are seeing, or not seeing.
If they do see stuff, they are rarely 6's and if so, small.
And those bulls even if around, aren't lasting long once the season opens.
So, so much more a decent breeding stock, when it get to this point, so yes, we should be concerned.

#1, should I take offence?
That I drive 9hrs +, that I still hunt with family, in areas that should hold elk.
Yes I do take offence!
Especially when you think I don't work my ass off!!!
I put on more miles then just about anybody while I am there.
Is my only shortcoming that I am not there to hunt it 40 days like some, yes!.
Had I put in another week to the hunt, do I think I would have been successful, good chance yes.
As LBM said, there was a 6pt around, that had come down from up high.
How do I know, cause I worked my ass off! trying to find some elk to even hunt in there.
Just ran out of time!

#2 type, well I have done that as well, gone a little further south and to the left and to the right, and I don't see much
better down there.
Yes there are pockets of them, but a far cry from what once was.

Now, for your "HardCore" comment.
There are a few of you guys over the years, who think you are just that, and everyone else is not legit.
Without bringing up names directly, I remember one "real hardcore MD Hunter".
And it wasn't too long ago, just a couple of years back, where he like to "throw it in peoples faces" that they, the
#1's in your list, that had no clue what they were talking about, that they had no clue how to hunt, and they are just
babies etc.
On top of that, this same hardcore hunter would protest loudly when someone said areas were getting pounded by hunters, and that the game was getting shot up, blah bla bla.

Well, now this Hardcore MD hunter is now sounding like group #1?
Yet, he is a group#3 in your books.

I don't have an issue with MD and I hunt the same Region, but not same MU probably.
This hardcore hunter will probably go elsewhere as well, adjusting to the conditions, but I can tell you it still probably pisses him off that his honeyholes which should hold MD, do not now!

Now, do I put his skills to question, nope!
Do I just not believe him, because I am still having success?, nope.

I have said how the situation is for me as compared to him, and that I am not seeing the problems he is seeinh, which is fair, like you are with me!
Difference is, I have said to that hardcore MD hunter that it may only be a matter of time til I see the same sad results as him in my area.
(if it is the wolves or logging, that's up to debate, but #'s wouldn't be).
I just don't assume that because one is from the LM, that they are inadequate hunters.

I see a lot of locals who just drive all day long!.
I was talking about folks who's money is on the line, or live close by, and who do work at it.
The concern is, we have a large area that should hold elk, and isn't!
It is being under utilized and holding elk way below even a legitimate capacity!
That's what the concern is!
It's not just about me and my situation, or about you and your situation.
Its more about the future, and for those behind us coming up, who I am concerned more about.
If you disagree, fine, just don't categorize, a you have never spent a second in my boots, or know what miles I put on them or even where I am.
Hopefully the changes coming that are in discussion make a difference, but I am concerned that if they just plan on implementing more restrictions ( because that's all they can control, with little money involved), that it will be
a big failure.

But hey, I hope your right and I am wrong ( I do hope I am wrong cause if I am right, I do not feel so assured that it will be fixed anymore)

Please don't say things I didn't say, I never said there was a 6 point that had come down from up high.
I did say there was a 6 point in the area but he was in there, he was there in early sept.
Oh and to answer your PM yes was out looking for elk, you could quit sending those as well for so much of
what you say is contradicting.

[Bugle M In]

Nothing to chime in about just the same old stuff from you.
This is nothing new game numbers have been dropping in various areas of the EK for years many have brought this up before
and were told there is no issue, you your self were in that group on some instances.
Yes there is elk and other game in there and it will never be like it was before, and yes humans are a big factor or cause of the decline.
Yet you then but blame on the cow seasons, and say moose season could not handle general season.
So will say it again you don't have a clue what goes on in there the rest of the year other then the 10 days your there.
You want to believe what the outfitter, tourist operator, and your ex CO buddy tell you that's your choice.

I never blamed the cow season, not entirely, and never have.
It was the higher ups who stopped that hunt because they felt there was a problem and wanted to get #'s up.
And on top of that, at the same time put in 6pt restriction.
So, as you say, numbers are down, still, and you never included the road closures.

Funny thing is, you always state, people like me don't know what goes on here the "rest of the year".
There are a lot of us on here, who would love to finally know, from you LBM, what goes on up there the rest of the time.
Please enlighten us with your knowledge.
Tell us all why the game will never be like before.
Tell us please, since all the other folks are wrong.
Your almighty knowledge might help those who are in the dark actually correct the problem.
Heres you chance.

[Bugle M In]

Bugle m in mail box full

10/4, cleaned out, thanks, deleted lbm pm's...lol

[LBM]

I never blamed the cow season, not entirely, and never have.
It was the higher ups who stopped that hunt because they felt there was a problem and wanted to get #'s up.
And on top of that, at the same time put in 6pt restriction.
So, as you say, numbers are down, still, and you never included the road closures.

Funny thing is, you always state, people like me don't know what goes on here the "rest of the year".
There are a lot of us on here, who would love to finally know, from you LBM, what goes on up there the rest of the time.
Please enlighten us with your knowledge.
Tell us all why the game will never be like before.
Tell us please, since all the other folks are wrong.
Your almighty knowledge might help those who are in the dark actually correct the problem.
Heres you chance.

Again you just make things up, never said all other folks are wrong.
People that are concerned about it no, and there is those that are talked to about it, there are lots that are not in the dark.
Hopefully some can be fixed and maybe see a up turn someday.
On a side note CHB has posted some interesting thoughts/ideas last few days and JT quit often posts some good thoughts.

[Bugle M In]

Again you just make things up, never said all other folks are wrong.
People that are concerned about it no, and there is those that are talked to about it, there are lots that are not in the dark.
Hopefully some can be fixed and maybe see a up turn someday.
On a side note CHB has posted some interesting thoughts/ideas last few days and JT quit often posts some good thoughts.

So, whats your point???
I know JT has some very good points, and that he says that elk#'s are down in the EK.
Tghats all I have been trying to say, that it doesn't matter if I cut a tag, but when I see a big shift, in the worng direction, I think that's fair.
If I missed 1 6pt at the beginning of the season, so what, there should be more than just him in the area.
Only reason for the pm's was to keep your and my banter that happened last year, between us, as to not annoy others.
But again, you cant help yourself.

One thing you seem to do a lot of, not just with me, but many folks on here, especially of late again.
The other thing is, anyone if they want can see just what a member stands for on here.
All they have to do is go onto the persons profile, and look over all the posts they have contributed to.
In your case, its always the same bs.
You never seem to help anyone with "past experience", you never contribute to help others out.
Nothing!.
Just shows why many call you out as a Troll!
Why others say, disregard anything LBM has to say.
Why others think you are Anti.
On and on it goes with you.
A lot can be said by you and all that you contribute, which has been basically nothing.
And then confirm what I have been saying, thru what JT says.
That and all the poaching that goes on from your wisdom, because hey, you live there, and the CO's know squat!

Altleast when I got back home, I offered a few who I have gotten to know over the years some scouting info from my hunts and where they can go and start from, if they wanted.
And others I have shared where they can go for other game, like another for goat, if they want to.
And, in the same way, others have offered me advice, and many helped out to give info for my buddies son on his leh elk hunt of a lifetime.
You, I cant figure out which direction you point, at what given time, nor will I care after this post.
It's not even the few people I have spoken to that you have listed, but others who have shared similar experiences of late, and who did not even decide to take time to go up to hunt elk, because of the situation.
That's sad, when an area known for elk hunting, gets to its state it is now.
As for the "Kid", atleast I can respect that he puts the time in (something I know you don't, even less then me), and
if his experiences are different, so be it.
I have been in his shoes too, where I thought everything was fine, and others just didn't have clue.
But I can agree to disagree with him, but I will never allow to be insulted on "putting in a hardcore effort" when I
do show up.

You have to make up your mind who you are, and what you want to be, and if you will ever decide to contribute to others, be a part of the solution, or just chronic waste of time for many on here!?

[willyqbc]

Keep it between the lines gentlemen....airing out some personal fued will get this thread deleted.

Thanks
Chris

[Bugle M In]

Keep it between the lines gentlemen....airing out some personal fued will get this thread deleted.

Thanks
Chris

I here ya, and have tried.
I can accept a different perspective from the kid, but there is one individual who even after trying last year to take it to pm, to keep it out of the forum as not to waste others time and have it continually repeat itself.
Thought it had been rectified to a point where all could move on.
However, I see that Gatehouse was right in his advice, to just "ignore" him.

[northof49]

As said b4......ignore the fool. Just a troll

[Bugle M In]

As said b4......ignore the fool. Just a troll

I know, I should have given up before I even started with him.