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Thread: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

  1. #11
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    Sep 2011
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    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    Quote Originally Posted by jaybe14 View Post
    Hi Timberjack,

    thanks for the advice, I appreciate it. I'm going to be looking for a 25-50x eye piece model, your review reinforced what I read on the birding forums.
    I haven't bought yet, I'm just selling a couple last guns/scopes to put the money towards this. Hoping to have it by November so I can use on a 4pt buck only hunt.
    Jaybe
    I have the same scope you are about to buy. From my experience I can tell you, that you won't be disappointed. A scope like this will last you the rest of your days and then some. Good luck

  2. #12
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    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    It's hardly worth paying an extra 200$ for the 25-50 power because the increase in FOV is marginal.

    Model Eyepiece type Field of view @ 1000 yds Eye relief Price
    20-60xS Zoom 108-60 ft 17 mm
    25-50xS Zoom, wide angle 138-89 ft 17 mm

    Only 30 ft. increase in the 25-50 over the 20-60 lens. And since both are used on the 65 HD, there is no difference in light gathering quality since that depends on the object lens.

    On the other hand, the increase in power from 50 to 60 is a substantial gain.
    Lest we forgetHumbolt Broncos Tragedy
    " I'm trying to not get cynical about what is a totally devastating tragedy but the maleness, the youthfullness and the whiteness of the victims are playing a significant role."
    Nora Loreto 6:49 PM 8 Apr. 2018


    Nostra es Devs Spes



  3. #13
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    Mar 2006
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    1,987

    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    ^ 30 feet is actually decent. Difference between keeping one buck in view at 1000y or keeping 3 in view :/

    And besides, how useful is 60x? Its gotta be significantly dimmer than 50x.

    I mean for a 65mm at 60x that's a one millimeter exit pupil. That's TINY!
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  4. #14
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    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    Quote Originally Posted by Jagermeister View Post
    It's hardly worth paying an extra 200$ for the 25-50 power because the increase in FOV is marginal.

    Model Eyepiece type Field of view @ 1000 yds Eye relief Price
    20-60xS Zoom 108-60 ft 17 mm
    25-50xS Zoom, wide angle 138-89 ft 17 mm

    Only 30 ft. increase in the 25-50 over the 20-60 lens. And since both are used on the 65 HD, there is no difference in light gathering quality since that depends on the object lens.

    On the other hand, the increase in power from 50 to 60 is a substantial gain.
    Well, everybody is entitled to their opinion, but I totally disagree with you. Firstly, $200 is a marginal increase compared to the total investment, and assuming it's going to last you 20 plus years, the increased cost over that period of time is next to nil. So I tend to go for what is best, not what is cheapest. As for the scope itself, the FOV increase is between 27% and 48% depending on what power you're at. THAT'S HUGE!!! It's a massive increase that explains why you feel like you're looking through a tunnel with the 20-60.

    Now as far as practical use, twoseven0 has it right... the increased FOV is the difference between 1 buck or three bucks at 1000y, or better yet no bucks vs 1 buck... Not to mention the comfort to your eye with reduced eyestrain. Having looked through the two scopes side by side I can tell you that between 50 and 60 power, the non-wide angle eyepiece is dimmer, less clear, and even on a cool cloudy day has enough mirage to distort the image significantly enough that it's rendered useless for precision viewing such as counting antler points. Believe me, I've been there..

    Now everybody's eyes are different, so I assume that based on your comments that you've looked through both of them side by side in the field in the same conditions and have experienced something different than myself? Seems odd cause for me there's no comparison. Anyway, for me $200 is nothing compared to the comfort that I want for my eyes on a multi day trip in the mountains, so it doesn't even come into the equation for me...

  5. #15
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    Aug 2013
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    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    I find the mirage between 40-60x make that end almost unusable except for general work. I wouldn't want to bet a goat/sheep hunt on it, that's for sure. If you are looking closer in at those powers the clarity is amazing. Not so much a 1600m....
    Last edited by the_longwalker; 09-14-2018 at 10:39 AM.

  6. #16
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    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    Lets consider twilight factor: a mathematical formula that shows how how both the size of the objective lens and the magnifying power contribute to the scopes ability to show detail in the dim light of dawn and dusk.
    To determine the ability we multiply the diameter of objective lens by the current power that the scope is set to. On the 25-50X, the twilight factor ranges from 40 to 56.5 whereas the 20-60X ranges from 36 to 62. Both lenses have the same twilight factor at 25X.
    *The exit pupil distances are identical at 17mm for both eyepieces but the exit pupil diameter is greater for the 20-60X. This then too gives the edge for relative brightness to the 20-60X. For those that are concerned about weight and are shaving ounces, you guessed it, the 20-60X is lighter by 1.2 ounces or 35g.
    Both have 9 optical elements.
    In summary: The 20-60X exceeds the 25-50X in all aspects except for the paltry wider FOV and cost.
    *The notion that looking through the 20-60X gives a tunnel effect is erroneous given that both exit pupils are the same.

    "
    I find the mirage between 40-60x make that end almost unusable except for general work. I wouldn't want to bet a goat/sheep hunt on it, that's for sure. If you are looking closer in at those powers the clarity is amazing. Not so much a 1600m.... "
    A couple of years ago, I was in the backyard watching through my (Swarovski HD 65ATS with a 20-60X eyepiece) a couple of young men hiking the mountain to the south . From my spot to them ranged a distance of 1.6 km. These two fellows decided to roll some boulders down the mountain which is no big deal providing there is nothing below that come in harm's way, like a highway off to the side a bit or somebodies hiking in to view the falls. Just so happened that my neighbor of the day was a local detachment officer home for supper. I called him over to point out what was transpiring and he came to have a look. Cranked at 60X he said although he could not make out facial detail, he had sufficient detail of their clothing to know who to look for. He located them later that evening, didn't arrest but gave a stern reprimand and consequences should it happen again.
    Lest we forgetHumbolt Broncos Tragedy
    " I'm trying to not get cynical about what is a totally devastating tragedy but the maleness, the youthfullness and the whiteness of the victims are playing a significant role."
    Nora Loreto 6:49 PM 8 Apr. 2018


    Nostra es Devs Spes



  7. #17
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    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    I don’t dispute your abilities in the stats or the math, and I don’t dispute that the HD 65 ATS with the 20-60 power is very very good. But I’m telling you there is no comparison when viewed side by side. The WA is better. PERIOD. Clearer, brighter, wider FOV and less eye strain. Have you compared them side by side?
    Last edited by Timberjack; 09-14-2018 at 10:14 PM.

  8. #18
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    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    Oh and no matter how much math you use to convince us all that there is no tunnel effect with the 20-60, I’m telling you it FEELS that way when COMPARED with the WA eyepiece.

    Anyway, everyone is entitled to their opinion and I respect that.
    Last edited by Timberjack; 09-14-2018 at 10:18 PM.

  9. #19
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    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    Cranked at 60X he said although he could not make out facial detail, he had sufficient detail of their clothing to know who to look for.

    This is my point exactly. Now you are counting rings on a sheep. I live in Stewart, right between two massive mountains that have goats on them. From my yard is is 1400m to the top. In the afternoon, the thermals give off so much mirage all you can see is a goat. No way to tell between a billy or nanny.

  10. #20
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    Re: Swarovski spotter - 65mm - 25-50x wide angle vs 20-60x

    Quote Originally Posted by Timberjack View Post
    Oh and no matter how much math you use to convince us all that there is no tunnel effect with the 20-60, I’m telling you it FEELS that way when COMPARED with the WA eyepiece.

    Anyway, everyone is entitled to their opinion and I respect that.
    Thanks Timber - the 20-60x is a great scope, but like you said a few bucks more when you are already dropping $3K on spotting scope/tripod is worth while. The "birding" guys also used the tunnel vision reference when comparing side by side and said after they looked through both 9/10 went with the WA.

    I might buy new if nothing pops up on the used market for this in the next few months. Once again.. to all you who replied and advised thank you very much!

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