NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

[northernguy]

I would like to thank Sirloin for starting this thread and giving this issue some public exposure. I have been talking to people about this all week and most weren't aware it is happening. As a resident of 5-13 this situation is very concerning to me, my friends and neighbors. The worst thing right now is that it's all clouded with uncertainty. We can all speculate about the implications and how it will affect our rights and freedom to continue to go and do what most of us have been doing all our lives. As hunting season draws closer, I think the B.C. Government owes us some clarification about what's going on here--who is actually running this show! If people start spending valuable time and money going out to exercise their legal hunting rights, only to encounter road blocks and other obstructions intended to discourage legal hunting, it will only lead to kayos and blow the lid off the whole situation.
Respectfully, Max Ranger.

Uncertainty is an undesirable state in an effective democracy. Lets hope that our "leaders" understand that their role is to lead. Lead; as defined as "exercising the art and science of affecting human behaviour in order too accomplish a mission in the manner so desired by the leader (Canadian Forces definition)".

My fear is that the "leaders" both FN and Non-FN, have no idea that the "mission" is to establish a society where we all work together for common goals. Each have their own, self serving "mission statement" and until it becomes unified...we're screwed.

[Jelvis]

As a quarter-breed, noted by many for years, I got identified as an Indian under the final count, by %, but now it's changed, If you or someone you know says, " I got Indian blood in me from so and so or my heritage has First Nation!-- check on line, new regulations, if you have a parent with " Native, First Nation and is i'deed already or a grandparent etc or prove a relative history, Bango!
-- Now you can apply if you have the proper codes and can use a computer properly. My bro who is super smart, had all the codes for the computer and can use them.
-- Don't ask me because I don't have them and can't use a computer very good.
Jel - I know the Indian who is a top lawyer in Vancouver, who got this law changed -- by himself, And now has become a Status Indian -- he was 1/8th blood --
--------------Blood line and dna now not how many percent Native you are anymore ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------This new thing their voting on now, the Band itself will pick the members not the Federal gov't the applying member will have to have one parent as a member.
--This type of thing can change with the groups involved as you know how life goes -- Shit Happens -

[Pemby_mess]

Uncertainty is an undesirable state in an effective democracy.

I hope it takes another 20 years to work out the details.
I'm selling in 2.

I'm buying, but I think I'll wait to see how this whole thing pans out - I'll make you an offer in 20 years when there's finally a resolution. That's if I haven't found anything better before now and then

[Pemby_mess]

Lead; as defined as "exercising the art and science of affecting human behaviour in order too accomplish a mission in the manner so desired by the leader (Canadian Forces definition)".

I'm not so fond of that definition as it relates to general democratic leadership. It makes sense that the military defines it that way. Military leadership is much less compromising for good reason. But there are different leadership styles for different applications and knowing which one to apply when is part of the art and science. Often the leader doesn't know which way to go - humility is an admirable trait in a leader for most applications. Maybe not for the battlefield however.

[browningboy]

I’m still wonder why this hasn’t hit the news

[Jelvis]

Hey browning? Different reasons why? Can you think of 1?
--- one reason this threads news hasn't tipped off the BC public?
-- I think this thread has opened some eyes, some guests eyes! It clued me in a bit too on what was happening thanks to Sirloin and his computer skills!
-- right now this transferring of power we all feel happening among us here in BC on HBC is a real thing, it's not our imaginations.
Jel -- one reason? - Global hasn't bin first with this? - People in the public's eyes with jobs and positions, don't want to touch these subjects involving First Nations in - - BC, with a ten foot pole -- just as soon pass on it! -- That's one reason these topics will never come to completion in our life times .. this isn't even close to final --
-----------> The longer the lawyers keep fighting each other, they get paid more so it's not going to end in I'd say even come close to signed for fifty years! Hahaha

[j270wsm]

You don't get to vote on any large land holder's internal policies unless you have an ownership stake/management role. Not sure why this would be, or even should be any different. If you were to hunt on their land, you'd be subject to their rules, that of the the province, and the fed's. Again, not understanding why this should be any different?

The position of the FN, is that the crown land was never "ours" to begin with. So from their perspective, they're not really taking anything away from you, but just having what was rightfully theirs all along, restored.

Its only the last 2-3 generations that claim that the land was theirs. The generations before them claimed that they took care of the land.

210% of bc is claimed by natives correct?.......so if/when this bs goes through, how long until every other band jumps on he wagon and the entire province is owned by the natives??

Your correct that the public doesn't get the right to vote on land owners policies but land owners don't get to make their own rules when it comes to allocation, mineral/fossil fuel extraction, logging, water use......etc

the big big picture is that this agreement will set precidence for all natives and eventually 3% of bc residents will own us all.

[browningboy]

Hey browning? Different reasons why? Can you think of 1?
--- one reason this threads news hasn't tipped off the BC public?
-- I think this thread has opened some eyes, some guests eyes! It clued me in a bit too on what was happening thanks to Sirloin and his computer skills!
-- right now this transferring of power we all feel happening among us here in BC on HBC is a real thing, it's not our imaginations.
Jel -- one reason? - Global hasn't bin first with this? - People in the public's eyes with jobs and positions, don't want to touch these subjects involving First Nations in - - BC, with a ten foot pole -- just as soon pass on it! -- That's one reason these topics will never come to completion in our life times .. this isn't even close to final --
-----------> The longer the lawyers keep fighting each other, they get paid more so it's not going to end in I'd say even come close to signed for fifty years! Hahaha

not certain, but seems like there’s a lot more involved and more at stake then just a land deal, just seems like the government is trying to make large deals that affect a lot of people and sweep them under the rug

[Pemby_mess]

Its only the last 2-3 generations that claim that the land was theirs. The generations before them claimed that they took care of the land.

lol. I think, if you're not already, that you should become a lawyer. That's quite the semantic distinction. Though I am under the the impression that since the Crown can't prove good faith and consideration being exchanged, the common law defaults title to the original beneficial users.

Anyway, i don't know if land claims are as new as you think they are. The Nisgaa settlement provides a good example in that the 1990's version, looked identical in a lot of ways to the version that started the process in the 1900's. And that group was probably somewhat less sophisticated than their neighbours like the tlingitt, and the Haida.

210% of bc is claimed by natives correct?.......so if/when this bs goes through, how long until every other band jumps on he wagon and the entire province is owned by the natives??

Your correct that the public doesn't get the right to vote on land owners policies but land owners don't get to make their own rules when it comes to allocation, mineral/fossil fuel extraction, logging, water use......etc

yeah, its a quagmire, as i've acknowledged. And so i dont know why we necessarily need to negotiate away every beneficial use to the land along with the title. It seems to me, that some creative options can be explored in regard to the types of things you mention and more. Maybe the courts need to come up with a new legal structure to account for this unprecedented situation.

the big big picture is that this agreement will set precidence for all natives and eventually 3% of bc residents will own us all.

Is owning land the same thing as them owning us? No wonder they're pissed but i agree, the process is fraught with pitfalls. Good reason for the people of BC to get themselves up to speed on the facts of the matter, and do it right. The result will be worse for the Crown (and by extension "us") if its left to the courts completely.

[Jack Russell]

not certain, but seems like there’s a lot more involved and more at stake then just a land deal, just seems like the government is trying to make large deals that affect a lot of people and sweep them under the rug

The question is, as the government is giving it all away for UNDRIP, what is the gov't hiding and keeping from us, for themselves and their best pals?