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Thread: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

  1. #31
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    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

    Quote Originally Posted by HappyJack View Post
    Isn't that what they did on the Douglas Lake Ranch?? Huge tract of land covered in wild game animals, but no access?? Sound familiar?
    Happy Jack, if you worked your ass off to buy a piece of property....(forget the scale, doesn't matter if it's 1 acre or 1 million)....and folks showed up demanding access with a claim. How does one deal with this.

    I get the argument....loud and clear.
    Some have laid claim siting rights.

    Can they fish and hunt your property?
    Can they log your property?
    Can they mine it?
    Can they deny access to you?
    Where does it end?

    Boundaries and goal posts need to be defined as my fear is the farm is being given away with no plan other than appeasement and no end in sight. Those that are given will always justify it and ask for more until the hammer comes down saying this is where it ends.

    Open deals are always exploited.


    I'm all in favor of keeping dangerous weapons out of the hands of fools. Let's start with keyboards and forums. - F L Wright


    Try and be kind to everyone but fear no one. - Ourea


  2. #32
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    Whonnock for 19 years, Mission for 46 years
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    4,720

    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

    Not advocating illegal or radical responses, but I can see properties that's taken many years to develop
    even businesses as well whole large scale parts of contested areas mysteriously going up in flames rather
    than having someone take them away and reap the benefits of another's hard work and monies...just saying.
    It wouldn't be the first time someone refused to let someone profit for their hard work.

  3. #33
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    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

    Quote Originally Posted by Ourea View Post
    Happy Jack, if you worked your ass off to buy a piece of property....(forget the scale, doesn't matter if it's 1 acre or 1 million)....and folks showed up demanding access with a claim. How does one deal with this.

    I get the argument....loud and clear.
    Some have laid claim siting rights.

    Can they fish and hunt your property?
    Can they log your property?
    Can they mine it?
    Can they deny access to you?
    Where does it end?

    Boundaries and goal posts need to be defined as my fear is the farm is being given away with no plan other than appeasement and no end in sight. Those that are given will always justify it and ask for more until the hammer comes down saying this is where it ends.

    Open deals are always exploited.
    The scary part is.... the courts will decide,,,, the courts stacked with Liberal judges.

  4. #34
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    1,082

    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

    This is treason against Canadian people.

  5. #35
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    Dec 2016
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    1,125

    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations




    NStQ private lands , listed in appendix D....




    And no public access to what is in appendix D. It's left blank.

  6. #36
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    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

    If they really try to start taking people's property and handing it over this will get ugly. I mean real ugly and I honestly don't believe the government is ready for it. I do not support those actions but can certainly understand them. That being said, there are several groups across Canada, and north America, that do not share my disdain for bloodshed. I said when the courts first ruled ruled that the First Nation rights could only be lost through treaty or war all that did was tie the hands of the people.

    I do believe that if left as is there will be blood spilled over this but not a war. But there is a war coming. It always amazes me how people break this down into white vs natives. I know many immigrants from other countries with a strong fishing, hunting and outdoor commitment. They do not feel the guilt that guides so many decisions today. They came to Canada because of the freedoms granted to them and will not take kindly to them being stripped away.
    I don't shoot innocent animals... Just the ones that look guilty!

  7. #37
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    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

    If the provincial government tries to “give” privately held lands away as part of a settlement, they will have so many lawsuits filed against them that it will bankrupt the province. If they remove all public services and assign tax collection duties to the FN, there will also be hell to pay. The original Gustafson Lake Stand-off will look like a tea party in comparison! Only this time it will be the non-natives blockading. And I will support them 100%.

  8. #38
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    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

    Quote Originally Posted by Mulehahn View Post
    If they really try to start taking people's property and handing it over this will get ugly. I mean real ugly and I honestly don't believe the government is ready for it. I do not support those actions but can certainly understand them. That being said, there are several groups across Canada, and north America, that do not share my disdain for bloodshed. I said when the courts first ruled ruled that the First Nation rights could only be lost through treaty or war all that did was tie the hands of the people.

    I do believe that if left as is there will be blood spilled over this but not a war. But there is a war coming. It always amazes me how people break this down into white vs natives. I know many immigrants from other countries with a strong fishing, hunting and outdoor commitment. They do not feel the guilt that guides so many decisions today. They came to Canada because of the freedoms granted to them and will not take kindly to them being stripped away.
    I would recommend reading through Appendix L here:
    And Ctrl+F searching for "Expropriation" or "parcel" in the treaty

    Interesting point here:

    24.2.2 Prior to the Final Agreement, NStQ and British Columbia will negotiate and attempt to reach agreement on:

    a. NStQ authority to impose property taxes on Persons who are not
    NStQ Citizens in relation to those Persons' ownership or occupation
    of NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands; and
    b. the coordination of the exercise of the NStQ taxation authority with
    British Columbia's tax systems.

    APPENDIX L-1: LIMITS ON PROVINCIAL EXPROPRIATION

    GENERAL
    1. Provincial Law applies to the expropriation of NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands by a
    Provincial Expropriating Authority except to the extent that the Final Agreement
    modifies its application.
    2. A Provincial Expropriating Authority may expropriate an Interest in NStQ Treaty
    Settlement Lands only with the consent and by the order of the Lieutenant Governor
    in Council.
    3. The Lieutenant Governor in Council may issue an order consenting to an
    expropriation of an Interest in NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands only:
    a. after the conclusion of the procedures described in paragraphs 4 through
    5; and
    b. where the expropriation is justifiable in accordance with paragraph 6.
    4. Before the Lieutenant Governor in Council makes a decision under paragraph 3, the
    Provincial Expropriating Authority will provide a report to NStQ which states the
    reasons for the expropriation and addresses the factors under subparagraphs 6a to
    6d.
    5. Within 30 days of receipt of the report under paragraph 4, NStQ will notify the
    Provincial Expropriating Authority if it objects to the expropriation of the Interest in
    NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands and, within 30 days of the Provincial Expropriating
    Authority’s receipt of notice from NStQ, the Provincial Expropriating Authority and
    NStQ will make reasonable efforts to resolve the objection raised by NStQ.
    6. For the purposes of subparagraph 3b, an expropriation is justifiable where the
    Lieutenant Governor in Council is satisfied that the following requirements have
    been met:
    a. reasonable efforts have been made by the Provincial Expropriating
    Authority to acquire the Interest in NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands through
    agreement with NStQ;
    b. there is no other reasonably feasible alternative to the expropriation,
    including the use of lands that are not NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands;
    This AIP is not legally binding and has not been signed by the Parties. Hard copies are available to the public upon request to British Columbia or Canada. NStQ Treaty Negotiations — Draft Appendices to the Agreement in Principle — July 2, 2015 Page 185 of 253
    c. the Provincial Expropriating Authority has confirmed that the proposed
    expropriation is of the smallest Interest in NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands
    necessary and is for the shortest time required;
    d. information relevant to the expropriation, other than documents that would
    be protected from disclosure under Provincial Law, has been provided to
    NStQ, including the report referred to in paragraph 4; and
    e. where NStQ has objected to the expropriation, reasonable efforts have
    been made to resolve the objection.
    7. The Lieutenant Governor in Council will not consent to the expropriation before the
    end of the period provided for in paragraph 5.
    8. Notwithstanding paragraphs 3 to 7, the Lieutenant Governor in Council may consent
    to the expropriation if the Minister or Lieutenant Governor in Council has declared a
    state of emergency.


    COMPENSATION


    9. In the event an Interest in NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands is expropriated by a
    Provincial Expropriating Authority, the Provincial Expropriating Authority will provide
    compensation in accordance with the Final Agreement.
    10.The total value of compensation for an expropriated Interest in NStQ Treaty
    Settlement Lands will be based on the criteria used in the Expropriation Act and will
    take into account the following factors:
    a. the market value of the land based on its use at the date of expropriation
    plus reasonable damages;
    b. the market value of the land based on its highest and best use at the date
    of expropriation;
    c. the value of a special economic advantage to the owner arising out of his
    or her occupation or use of the land; and
    d. the value of improvements made by an owner occupying a residence
    located on the land.
    11.Where the Provincial Expropriating Authority and NStQ disagree on the total value of
    compensation for the expropriated Interest held by NStQ, a dispute under this
    section will be finally determined by arbitration. A dispute under this section will not
    delay the expropriation. For the purpose of this section, British Columbia will act on
    This AIP is not legally binding and has not been signed by the Parties. Hard copies are available to the public upon request to British Columbia or Canada. NStQ Treaty Negotiations — Draft Appendices to the Agreement in Principle — July 2, 2015 Page 186 of 253
    behalf of the Provincial Expropriating Authority on such terms as British Columbia
    and the Provincial Expropriating Authority may agree.


    EXPROPRIATION OF LESS THAN FEE SIMPLE ESTATE


    12.Where less than a fee simple estate in a parcel of NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands is
    expropriated by a Provincial Expropriating Authority:
    a. the parcel of land retains its status as NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands;
    b. NStQ may continue to use and occupy the parcel of land, except to the
    extent that such use or occupation interferes with the use of land for which
    the expropriation took place; and
    c. NStQ Law applies to the parcel of land, except to the extent that NStQ
    Law is inconsistent with the use of land for which the expropriation took
    place.
    13.Paragraphs 14 through 22 do not apply to an expropriation by a Provincial
    Expropriating Authority of less than the fee simple estate in a parcel of NStQ Treaty
    Settlement Lands.


    EXPROPRIATION OF A FEE SIMPLE ESTATE


    14.Where a fee simple estate in NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands is expropriated by a
    Provincial Expropriating Authority:
    a. the expropriation will include the fee simple estate to the Subsurface
    Resources which will revert to British Columbia at the time of expropriation
    unless British Columbia and NStQ agree otherwise;
    b. unless the Provincial Expropriating Authority and NStQ agree otherwise,
    the expropriation will include all other Interests in the land; and
    c. those lands will no longer be NStQ Treaty Settlement Lands and Appendix
    B will be deemed to amended in accordance with the amendment process
    set out in paragraph 2.14.11 of the General Provisions Chapter.
    15.For the purposes of paragraph 14:
    a. the Provincial Expropriating Authority will be responsible for the
    transaction costs including the cost of surveying, registering and
    transferring the land; and
    This AIP is not legally binding and has not been signed by the Parties. Hard copies are available to the public upon request to British Columbia or Canada. NStQ Treaty Negotiations — Draft Appendices to the Agreement in Principle — July 2, 2015 Page 187 of 253
    b. where the land is registered in the Land Title Office, British Columbia will
    file such certificates or other documents in the Land Title Office as may be
    required under the Land Title Act.
    Last edited by Sirloin; 07-24-2018 at 08:14 AM.

  9. #39
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    Dec 2016
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    1,125

    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

    It appears Trudeau and his liberals are rushing to get these treaties through all across the country and now with NDP+Greens in power here, in BC.
    Maybe environmental activist governments see this as a good way to help save the planet?

    It is very important that NO ONE LOSE THEIR COOL and end up in an unneeded confrontation.
    Any situation will inevitably be used, and work against us. The current state of the media and public is in a state of racial moral panic. The media has a hard on for any story about negative interactions between someone white and someone non white, to underscore this oppressor vs oppressed narrative.

    They have lead front pages with such mundane negative interactions such as an "ethnic" customer trying to pass fake coupons and being asked to leave. Even things like this are being painted as outrageous, pure racism of the white store clerk. There has been dozens of mundane, "negative interaction = racism" stories similar to this leading the news lately.

    Any event will undoubtedly be used to help fuel this native supremacy legal/activism/extortion industry.

  10. #40
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    Re: NStQ First Nations, B.C., Canada advance to final treaty negotiations

    Any white person now like Sirloin is saying, good advice! "Do not lose your cool at any time, when dealing with these issues when people are talking!" Any where!
    - If you have a good job and in a position of noteriety and say any wrong thing anywhere and someone records you, --- YOUR FIRED!
    Just like Donny's old popular show everyone loved.
    -- In a position of authority and get picked up on a recording on a cell phone saying something you'd never say in public! Your Fired!
    A cop, a c o a politician, a teacher, picked up on a recording on a personal cell phone -- saying something real foolish? YOUR FIRED!
    Jel -- When out and about now remember your being recorded 24 hours a day now all year long, motion detectors, cameras outside on posts, in yards etc.
    ----------- This is high tech now, you must realize, if you think your just talking to some person only, and they are the only ones that hear it? Your old fashioned now!
    Last edited by Jelvis; 07-24-2018 at 09:34 AM. Reason: I Got Friends in Low Places

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