west coast salmon closure 2018 thoughts

[VLD43]

One of the problems with hatcheries, is the fact that they narrow biodiversity. If you promote or enhance one small section of the larger salmon population, eventually disease can overwhelm the fishery. More diversity allows for better survival rates.

It appears the most immediate threats to salmon right now are warm water temperatures (the blob) and open pen fish farms. As much and all as DFO is seen to be incompetent , I would not want to walk a mile in their shoes ever. In spite of presenting good scientific data, the can never win. The minute they suggest shutting down fisheries, to conserve or aire on the side of conservation, every one whines. It's a now win situation. So DFO is concerned about returns and lowers limits, to allow for escapement. The fish return and the rivers end up heating up and the run is decimated. I am not a fan of DFO, but honestly every decision they make ends up being arm chair quarter backed by all.

As conservationists and sportsmen, I would suggest we support them more and encourage them to close fisheries that are having a difficult time. I remember David Anderson doing that very thing in the 90's. Everyone whined, but guess what, the numbers improved and everyone was happy. We can be part of the solution, or part of the problem. With some sacrifice on every ones part, maybe we can restore the fishery. Just some thoughts.

[835]

Mr VLD
you forgot one... High Ph rain.. Hatchery guy from Port told me they have linked Alvin Survival rate ( death rate ) to high Ph rain.
I did not include it in my list mostly because I didn't think of it at the time... But they combat this through treating the water with limestone and minerals through them big tanks..

Hatcheries are learning a lot in both how to breed fish and how to release them. Hatcheries have found that the old days of dumping fish in one spot was a bad idea. They have started to put together that fish come back to the same pool they were hatched in. They are also starting ot mix big fish with big fish and then the rest.

now I fully agree that wild stock if far superior, don't get me wrong... But the fact is we need fish. If we went full boar on the big systems and ran a pred assist on the smaller ones we might have something....

Hatchery V Wild debate has been going on forever, and im sure we can keep it going... To me, I love a good wild run of Oncorhynchus Mykiss.... I have fished a number of rivers that have never had hatchery blood in them and there is a difference..... but, with the way shit is going today What have we got?

So no Mr VLD im not by any stretch Arguing with you,,,, only my opinion is something needs to get done..
I think I might start sea duck hunting again for dog food...... Merganser Dog food

[VLD43]

Mr VLD
you forgot one... High Ph rain.. Hatchery guy from Port told me they have linked Alvin Survival rate ( death rate ) to high Ph rain.
I did not include it in my list mostly because I didn't think of it at the time... But they combat this through treating the water with limestone and minerals through them big tanks..

Hatcheries are learning a lot in both how to breed fish and how to release them. Hatcheries have found that the old days of dumping fish in one spot was a bad idea. They have started to put together that fish come back to the same pool they were hatched in. They are also starting ot mix big fish with big fish and then the rest.

now I fully agree that wild stock if far superior, don't get me wrong... But the fact is we need fish. If we went full boar on the big systems and ran a pred assist on the smaller ones we might have something....

Hatchery V Wild debate has been going on forever, and im sure we can keep it going... To me, I love a good wild run of Oncorhynchus Mykiss.... I have fished a number of rivers that have never had hatchery blood in them and there is a difference..... but, with the way shit is going today What have we got?

So no Mr VLD im not by any stretch Arguing with you,,,, only my opinion is something needs to get done..
I think I might start sea duck hunting again for dog food...... Merganser Dog food

Mr 835
Your so formal. I will have to come to your place of work and consult with your work mates. They have obviously been getting your goat. Anyway, your forgot to mention ocean acidification, , which has the scientists very concerned for all marine wildlife. The point of my previous post, was to suggest that in spite of every ones passion for fishing and us not wanting to loose it forever, maybe we all need to step back, and give the resource a chance to recover. As I mentioned in an earlier post, we are racing to the end, and if were not careful, there may be nothing to fish. Obviously the science is changing as the environment changes. Mother nature could have the final say. Best to aire on the side of cuation.

[IronNoggin]

If science backs it I would agree with a closure. I don't see a lot of effort being put into saving what feeds the salmon, and what feeds that. It has to start from the bottom up.

Science in fact does not back up the government's current plans.

Most sportfishers would gladly accept a reduced season if it was supported by science. However, the DFOs own scientists have repeatedly said of all the options available a sportfishing reduction would have the least impact. But science doesn't matter, only appearances and the government must be seen doing something.

In fact what the biologists told management was that fisheries closures represent the "least effective option" for having any significant positive impact towards producing more chinook salmon for the apparently starving orcas to consume. What they suggested first and foremost was a three pronged approach, which included ramping up hatchery production immediately, initiating long term habitat mitigation / construction projects, and effectively reducing the number of sea lions and seals in numerous "hot spot" locations along the coast.

The government's reply was Fine, we'll shut down the fisheries then.

At this point what is proposed (and unfortunately the comment period has passed) is area closures for recreational fishers from the mouth of the Fraser and out through the straits. Multiple sites, total fin-fish closures meaning no halibut, prawns, crabs or anything else can be fished for there. Additional actions are cutting the overall recreational harvest by 25 - 30 %, reducing the time on the water and Area F Troll harvest by a minimum of 30%, and considerations for more area closures in the future, and "reducing noise levels from ships and watercraft" in so called sensitive feeding areas within the Straits.

In other words, attempting to appear to be doing something, while enacting the least effective (by science) method to address the situation. Typical of DFO and ever so typical of this particular government.

The whales face more problems than simply shortages at the grocery store. Many are carrying chemical burdens of such magnitude they could rightfully be considered toxic - and that is wrecking havoc with their breeding success (lack thereof actually).

The problem is complex. There is no single "smoking gun" and no single approach will make any real difference. The government knows this, but continues to play Russian Roulette with both salmon and orca stocks. Downright shameful.

And as if the understanding of the bottlenecks were not painfully clear, the government just announced 9.1 million dollars of funding support for more studies as to why they are in trouble. That level of funding could have been much better utilized if oriented towards what science already understands to be the proper steps to start dealing with the matter. Oh well, some Jazzy type gets a pet project, and will happily study the whales... right to death...

http://theprovince.com/pmn/news-pmn/...7-d2abe9fc35e3

https://www.canada.ca/en/fisheries-o...tion-plan.html

Given the initial closures are doomed to failure, mark my words, there will be more of this ineffective bullshit headed our way in the coming years...

Ticked,
Nog

[Brez]

In other words, attempting to appear to be doing something, while enacting the least effective (by science) method to address the situation. Typical of DFO and ever so typical of this particular government.

Nog

Hey, we gotta be getting used to this by now...and not just this gov't but all of them including the federal one who is throwing away $1.3 billion on caribou after their habitat is long gone. Hate to repeat myself but once all of the wildlife is gone, the world can be exploited and raped to death. It doesn't seem to matter that it will be our death as well.

[.264winmag]

I like fish hatcheries. Wrestled with a 44# hatch Chinook in kyuquot years ago, nothing has compared to that scrap since. Look at the states what they have done and continue to do with hatcheries and habitat improvement. We should be raising fish all along the coast. As said what have we got to lose at this point. Rather catch a bunch of 3 yr olds then maybe one wild 4/5 yr old...

[gitnadoix]

I thought they had no choice because failure to do something puts them in violation of the SARA Act....and liable.....and we all know there is no way in hell the soya latte drinking corn-roled hair, wearing a toque in summer and sandals with wool sock crowed is ever gonna allow a sea lion or seal harvest or cull...even if they feed the meat to starving orphans it aint gonna be allowed.

[303savage]

DFO thinks this is going to save the killer whales.

I didn't think orcas were teratoral

[Muledeercrazy2]

With the decline in the salmon fishery over the years, I'm not sure what will actually make a difference. It does seem like commercial and aboriginal fisheries have a much greater impact and contribute far less to the economy, so it' a shame to not close them first.

As fishermen/people we should have seen the writing on the wall ten years ago. If not sooner. The quality and quantity of fish has disappeared.

[tubby]

835, it’s a common known fact among fisheries bios and people doing hatchery work that the guy who runs the Robertson creek hatchery is part of the reason for the Stamps demise and shit hatch returns.