Whitetail doe season... is it time to take end it?

[Wild one]

So in other words on MD ratios a restriction of 1 buck is not enough to maintain BC 20% ratio goal so you would rather continue down the same path of over harvesting bucks.

Logic is not there but OK

You support the harvest of WT to drop the numbers in favour of MD. It’s not about stable WT populations and hunting opportunities on them

Scientific theories that will support and against this. For this reason you will never have 100% support

Cat harvest even though I agree it is a correct step I know this is basically a go no where fight


One I agree 100% habitat is a big factor with MD but with poor management of the species and predator issues it will not achieve much for results. Parts of BC I would say the habitat could/has supported higher populations and no matter how much habitat enhancement done this alone won’t solve the problem


Overall BC has piss poor management

[Fisher-Dude]

So in other words on MD ratios a restriction of 1 buck is not enough to maintain BC 20% ratio goal so you would rather continue down the same path of over harvesting bucks.

Logic is not there but OK

You support the harvest of WT to drop the numbers in favour of MD. It’s not about stable WT populations and hunting opportunities on them

Scientific theories that will support and against this. For this reason you will never have 100% support

Cat harvest even though I agree it is a correct step I know this is basically a go no where fight


One I agree 100% habitat is a big factor with MD but with poor management of the species and predator issues it will not achieve much for results. Parts of BC I would say the habitat could/has supported higher populations and no matter how much habitat enhancement done this alone won’t solve the problem


Overall BC has piss poor management

Read what I said, again. More slowly this time. If I had crayons, I'd draw a picture for you.

[Wild one]

Read what I said, again. More slowly this time. If I had crayons, I'd draw a picture for you.

Can read clear as day and have not missed a thing

[blacklab]

That's too bad I heard they took away your crayons.
Tell your mommy to get you some non toxic ones.

[338win mag]

Sorry but those are your facts. I'll build my argument around what I see first hand. If those numbers are your only argument, then management screwed up again of they're managing to zero.They're well on their way.
I've noticed a common theme with replies to this thread, the most vocal of the anti white tail crown, live in the Okanagan where you have a shorter season, smaller bag limit, and have a population "by your own numbers"
that is 5 times greater than region 3. Explain that!

I have hunted wt in region 8 where I grew up for more than 40 years and live in region 3 now for 25+ years, I have never shot a wt in region 3, I have never shot a doe since the gos on does in any region, I have shot them when we had a leh season for them. I'm trying to wrap my mind around what others are thinking is all, i will sort through the bs as it comes.

[horshur]

Burn it. NDT type 4 winter range should burn every 5 - 15 years. We snuffed out every winter range fire we could, then wondered where the deer are.

There is a growing appetite for Wf treatments though, hopefully we can get more momentum for this. $$$ funding model, political buy-in, combine it with interface fire protection plans.

NDP forest critic talked of wf treatment. Quesnel had 5000ha identified ten years ago. Only 10 ha has been treated in that time.. but yes I would love to see this stuff happen and agree it would help.

[BCrams]

Fisher Dude has nailed everything and is in the loop. It is unfortunate some are not able to understand and grasp the picture and issues we have. .

Butcher - I can think of a few spots which could use a burn or two I think it’s great the wt pockets are bare to minimal in fringe areas. A good cat harvest at this time would help wouldn’t it seeing as it appears wolves have moved on.

Re: wolves. Everyone recognizes they are and have been a problem. However, outside of caribou recovery areas, heli control is likely not going to happen. Eventually there will be an equilibrium balance of sorts and by acquiring funding to work on key areas for habitat enhancement. (Some areas are good but we can do better)

if every hunter came together as a group and said let’s work on what we can control, (including increased cat harvest with habitat work), it can and will happen.

whitetails - not worried about them as a prolific species and I would rather see them at a level which allows for Mule deer to be present without having so many whitetails around feeding predators that in turn feed on Mule deer.

It has taken some some adjustments to hunt wt.

i have seen what “stock piling wildlife” in the peace where the hunting was pretty incredible but die offs occurred. I did not want numbers to return to seeing 100-200 deer in fields as I knew it wasn’t naturally sustainable. This time around we’re dealing with predators.

There’s a balance and achieving the balance means doing things like habitat work so that both wt and Mule deer can survive within a predator / prey landscape or equilibrium of sorts.

My take anyways.

[LBM]

I told you what the effect of WT and mule deer sharing range and having a high cat population was. That still holds true. But we'll never be permitted to manage to the letter of that science with so many loud social engineers battering on our decision makers. So, the best we can do is encourage people to hunt WT and support seasons that at least help to keep WT in check.

I support managing mule deer within conservation targets, and I support getting there by not allowing our WT populations to skyrocket, and by doing large scale habitat treatments.

Managers have already told us that the change to 1 mule deer won't grow the MD population, so I don't support the change because it won't help anything. I'm not a fan of changing regs that are feel-good only changes, like closing grizzly bears made NDP supporters feel good but won't help grizzly bears.

I've tried to help mule deer with proposals for more liberal cat seasons, but there's no appetite for that among decision makers nor the houndsmen.

Of the 3 things that help mule deer (habitat, controlling WT, and keeping cats at bay), the most important is habitat, and the other 2 aren't effective if the habitat isn't looked after. I've found that I can get results

Funny in another post you said " WE" put out proposals for cat seasons now you say I, maybe people don't buy them for they are not science based which you push so much, but just feel good or emotion based.
Maybe some just really know that the cat numbers are really down all ready in certain parts of regions.
Maybe some realize that killing off the whitetails has only caused the remaining cats to seek out another food source and quit possible eating some of the mule deer you say your trying to save. So since your saying these ideas are yours you may be to blame for there decline.

[horshur]

The cat regulations are counter to what would need to be done..you need to remove females. Only way to do this by the regulation is to harvest a female in heat cause she is not in company of another cougar...sorta. Cause she is often in the company of a tom.

[horshur]

Funny in another post you said " WE" put out proposals for cat seasons now you say I, maybe people don't buy them for they are not science based which you push so much, but just feel good or emotion based.
Maybe some just really know that the cat numbers are really down all ready in certain parts of regions.
Maybe some realize that killing off the whitetails has only caused the remaining cats to seek out another food source and quit possible eating some of the mule deer you say your trying to save. So since your saying these ideas are yours you may be to blame for there decline.

I can't speak of kootenay cougar numbers..but anecdotaly here some areas have less cats because there is no game period.