Cranbrook Whities

[Fisher-Dude]

Another recent field observation (linked to last one) has been in 2014, 2015 habitat burns. Open forest areas holding grass are barren of tracks which I thought would at least see some nocturnal feeding. Track sign is limited to areas where the understory did not burn - burning that understory is usually a primary goal. I'm assuming once forage is consumed in these areas, deer will venture farther from security cover.

My take on this is that the area is full of whitetails. Those burns were designed for mule deer (and elk), which prefer more open habitat with good sightlines. That's their defense.

The WT tracks you're seeing in the thick is what we expect from them - as a species, they love the thick shit, and rely more on the hide defense than the spot and bolt defense of their cousins.

It's entirely possible that you're not seeing much for tracks in the open because there simply aren't many mule deer there making use of it. You indicate a high pred load, which supports the fact that the WT are supplementing the pred's dinner plate and keeping numbers high.

So, it all ties in with the drivers for mule deer populations.

[Fisher-Dude]

Oh ? Isnt this the same stratigy being used to save the caribou from predators ? using the moose as a sacrifice . How is that working out ?

Pretty good.

However, in the other case in 2003, when the moose population north of Revelstoke, B.C., was reduced slowly using management techniques over 10 years, it stabilized the caribou population. The gradual reduction of moose caused the wolf population to decrease as well, rather than leaving a large population of hungry predators in the area to take down the ailing ungulates.

“That’s kind of a rare success story for caribou in Canada,” he said.

http://www.edmontonexaminer.com/2017...bou-population


The Revelstoke moose
reduction experiment began in 2003 when increased hunting permits were issued for
moose over an area encompassing the Columbia North, Columbia South, and FrisbyBoulder
caribou ranges. Moose declined from 1.5/km2 to less than 0.3/km2 in 2014, the
last reported estimate. Wolf abundance dropped from 25 in 2007 to less than 10 by
2009 and has remained low through 2014. This lowered wolf density translates into
winter densities of 9/1000km2 and summer densities of 5-8/1000km2. The Columbia
North caribou population was declining prior to moose reduction but has now stabilized.

http://cmiae.org/wp-content/uploads/...view-final.pdf

[Dannybuoy]

My take on this is that the area is full of whitetails. Those burns were designed for mule deer (and elk), which prefer more open habitat with good sightlines. That's their defense.

The WT tracks you're seeing in the thick is what we expect from them - as a species, they love the thick shit, and rely more on the hide defense than the spot and bolt defense of their cousins.

It's entirely possible that you're not seeing much for tracks in the open because there simply aren't many mule deer there making use of it. You indicate a high pred load, which supports the fact that the WT are supplementing the pred's dinner plate and keeping numbers high.

So, it all ties in with the drivers for mule deer populations.

Say what ?? Its pretty much the opposite ... Open spaces favour the WT which rely on flight , mulies head for the hills ,thick stuff.
But either way its the preds that are the root cause .
I'll need a moment to look at your last post on the caribou

[Wild one]

Say what ?? Its pretty much the opposite ... Open spaces favour the WT which rely on flight , mulies head for the hills ,thick stuff.
But either way its the preds that are the root cause .
I'll need a moment to look at your last post on the caribou

MD are dominant in the wide open prairie and steep country. Many add thick bush because here in B.C. they do in habit these areas. It is not that it is there ideal habitat but instead they filled the void with no other deer species inhabit it

WT are a bush deer even when they are found in the prairies there is always a form of timber or brush near by. I know this thought comes from seeing them in agriculture areas here in B.C.. They are there for the food and lower pressure then crownland. WT love thick bush but not too steep floater is better because yes they are a sprinter. There is way more WT hiding in BCs thick bush then anywhere else but they go unseen

FD is correct on the habitat

[Dannybuoy]

Pretty good.

However, in the other case in 2003, when the moose population north of Revelstoke, B.C., was reduced slowly using management techniques over 10 years, it stabilized the caribou population. The gradual reduction of moose caused the wolf population to decrease as well, rather than leaving a large population of hungry predators in the area to take down the ailing ungulates.

“That’s kind of a rare success story for caribou in Canada,” he said.

http://www.edmontonexaminer.com/2017...bou-population


The Revelstoke moose
reduction experiment began in 2003 when increased hunting permits were issued for
moose over an area encompassing the Columbia North, Columbia South, and FrisbyBoulder
caribou ranges. Moose declined from 1.5/km2 to less than 0.3/km2 in 2014, the
last reported estimate. Wolf abundance dropped from 25 in 2007 to less than 10 by
2009 and has remained low through 2014. This lowered wolf density translates into
winter densities of 9/1000km2 and summer densities of 5-8/1000km2. The Columbia
North caribou population was declining prior to moose reduction but has now stabilized.

http://cmiae.org/wp-content/uploads/...view-final.pdf

I think these articles were written with the agenda of showing that the actions that they support were correct,
just another case of bio's and newspapers distorting the truth .
You also forgot to mention the enclosed pens (wolf proof ) that were instrumental in the survival of the cows and calves ...? Oh yea and the fact that they shot 73 wolves in the vacinity of the caribou pens

[HighCountryBC]

Say what ?? Its pretty much the opposite ... Open spaces favour the WT which rely on flight , mulies head for the hills ,thick stuff.
But either way its the preds that are the root cause .
I'll need a moment to look at your last post on the caribou

The bolded part is not accurate at all..

[HighCountryBC]

It is no wonder we are so far behind the rest of North America with regards to wildlife. We have hunters who refuse to believe the experts and believe 4 pt seasons for mule deer will save them and that a 1 month doe season is killing off whitetails.

The literature is out there for anyone to read. The science is proven. When hunters in British Columbia stop pushing social measures and start getting behind the science, it is then that we will see meaningful things happen for wildlife.

[Salty]

It is no wonder we are so far behind the rest of North America with regards to wildlife. We have hunters who refuse to believe the experts and believe 4 pt seasons for mule deer will save them and that a 1 month doe season is killing off whitetails.

The literature is out there for anyone to read. The science is proven. When hunters in British Columbia stop pushing social measures and start getting behind the science, it is then that we will see meaningful things happen for wildlife.

This ^

[Dannybuoy]

The bolded part is not accurate at all..

You may be correct in the cranbrook area?In my personal experience in the okanagan, I would be correct.
I have seen Wt out grazing in the wide open fields just as the mule deer do . Same with cut blocks. I have shot maybe 10-15 mulie bucks and 25-30 wt ... no does. less than some more than others .....
It depends on the terrain , but the WT do adapt better if thats your point ?
My point was if the cut blocks dont have deer tracks , I seriously doubt that its because the wt are there but staying in the bushes ....

[Wild one]

You may be correct in the cranbrook area?In my personal experience in the okanagan, I would be correct.
I have seen Wt out grazing in the wide open fields just as the mule deer do . Same with cut blocks. I have shot maybe 10-15 mulie bucks and 25-30 wt ... no does. less than some more than others .....
It depends on the terrain , but the WT do adapt better if thats your point ?
My point was if the cut blocks dont have deer tracks , I seriously doubt that its because the wt are there but staying in the bushes ....

As someone who is die hard on WT yes they are often in that bush unseen in my opinion

I know lots of places that you rarely see WT in the open. With the added pressure of people targeting WT more once the doe season was created it has become even more common. There is tons of feed that does not involve cut blocks

I strictly target thick bush because of this

I would agree numbers are lower in some locations but buck vs doe ratios are better in the past there was way higher doe numbers