The future of our wildlife management plans.

[Wild one]

If you don't hunt the growth hard you effectively stall it. Nature will limit itself. There cannot be exponential growth for long..Not limiting game in productive areas will hasten the degradation of the area. Or it won't be long untill the vacuum created is filled with predators.

I don't think the population would go untouched as there is always willing to go that extra mile. I am thinking more along the lines of removing vehicle access not a hunting ban. I would also assume with mule deer they would migrate to other locations throughout the season and some would be harvested during these times. I am not a 100% with mule deer but I know with many animals young disperse into surrounding areas. For the most part restricting road access to a burn in my opinion is just limiting access to part of the deers range.

Predators are always a factor and increaseing prey no matter how it is achieved will increase predator numbers. Predator management will be an issue regardless. With many set on the idea of habitat inhancement to increase game numbers predator management will need to follow

I have seen the benifit of not trap areas on trap lines and the benifit of hunting areas where there is factors limiting hunting pressure. From what I experience I could see it potentially benifical with very small impact on hunting. How much of an improvement this could bring is the ? Are we talking 1 deer or a 100 I don't know

One I often ? Is if we as hunters impact numbers in high pressure areas through stress but this is merely something I wonder about

Again I have no idea how effective limiting road access to a burn could be at increasing deer numbers but understand the theory behind it

[Fisher-Dude]

Predators are always a factor and increaseing prey no matter how it is achieved will increase predator numbers. Predator management will be an issue regardless. With many set on the idea of habitat inhancement to increase game numbers predator management will need to follow

Proper habitat restoration isn't just about producing nutrition.

It includes restoring habitat that includes escape terrain.

For example, mule deer need sight lines, moose need blow down where those long legs are an advantage over shorter wolf legs, elk need thick ESSF to hide, etc.

Predator management can be accomplished with more than dead predators in many situations.

We have to manage with dead predators in areas that aren't going to be habitat-restored for a few years, and that's where we can pinpoint those efforts.

A recent mule deer study actually showed a negative response to gunning of basically all predators.

In many areas, if we take care of the habitat, the rest takes care of itself. With scarce resources and a large landscape, we need to focus efforts where one action (habitat) will look after two or more (nutrition, preds) issues.

[Dannybuoy]

Agreed. wildlife can't be stockpiled

Its this kind of thinking that separates the hunters ..... while there is a limit of wildlife that an area can support , both in quality and quantity , the numbers have shrunk to a minimum ? . If you had been in the Okanagan 20, 30, 40 or more years ago you wouldn't be questioning this fact .
While I may not know the solution , money isn't going to fix it .

[Wild one]

FD I will have to agree with you 100% on the importance of habitat beyond nutrition and how it plays a roll even with predator issues. Would also say we can agree winter survival where it limits snow pack.

[Fisher-Dude]

Its this kind of thinking that separates the hunters ..... while there is a limit of wildlife that an area can support , both in quality and quantity , the numbers have shrunk to a minimum ? . If you had been in the Okanagan 20, 30, 40 or more years ago you wouldn't be questioning this fact .
While I may not know the solution , money isn't going to fix it .

We tried stockpiling wildlife 20 years ago.

Then it snowed and 75% of them died.

Boxhitch is aware of the consequences of that failed experiment which was fueled by vocal minorities who wanted wildlife managed for social reasons rather than by science.

Money IS the solution, but most consumptive users want someone else to pay the bill, or someone else to show up for the work party. That has to change.

[Ourea]

Nice to see some are getting it, what a viable platform needs to be/should look like.
Some very good comments being made.
This is one of the few threads that has lead to progressive discussion.
It is creating unity rather than division.

The concept of creating a sustainable and long term funding model to address wildlife concerns has been platformed some time ago.
It is gaining traction and support from all sides including Gov.
Hopefully it comes to fruition.

[bownut]

Good stuff guys, this is how it starts, people sharing in a positive manner. Think of it like a good book and open the first page without skipping to the end.
Habitat seems to be the first chapter, look at all its factors and make more changes, changes base on input and science.
Put a hold on all the increased Opportunity and Seasons until habitat shows a positive change.
Stop the fear that if we back our Opportunity for a while that it will take years to get it back. Look at how fast we got to here.
Get out there and use the Predator Opportunities that we have already, not that it will have much effect but it's a start.
Be a positive critic of the science being used and ask how decisions were equated. It's ok to show that you care.
Support any organization that you feel are doing the right things and be ready to be questions, for it's those questions that will show truth.

Once again good stuff, I hope that what I brought to the table will create some common ground and start to establish that Round Table that Bearvalley spoke of.
Cheers

[bownut]

Question with regards to die off of the past.
Has this province in the past twenty years ever come near the Carrying Capacity of the land and does that thinking hold any truth considering all the increase in the habitat loss that we just spoke of?
That does not sound like good science to me.

[Wild one]

We tried stockpiling wildlife 20 years ago.

Then it snowed and 75% of them died.

Boxhitch is aware of the consequences of that failed experiment which was fueled by vocal minorities who wanted wildlife managed for social reasons rather than by science.

Money IS the solution, but most consumptive users want someone else to pay the bill, or someone else to show up for the work party. That has to change.

Dont take this the wrong way but I honestly believe a portion of the public would be more likely to pony up the cash if the seen an indepth plan on what the $ was going towards. We all here habitat enhancement, predator control, and wildlife studies but on a provincial level this is not very indepth.

The public is not very trusting in this day and age. We have all watch organizations waste $ that was given with good intentions with little to no results and than be asked for more. Lots of cons and broken promises have made it so many don't part with there hard earned $

I would say a trust issue is more likely than hunters not willing to put $ towards wildlife. Than add in the hunters that do not hear about projects they would be willing to invest in.

Indepth information on projects and getting the information to a larger number of those who might be intrested in donating. Lots of hunters out there that care about BCs wildlife but have no intrest in joining clubs or other organizations.

[Stone Sheep Steve]

If you don't hunt the growth hard you effectively stall it. Nature will limit itself. There cannot be exponential growth for long..Not limiting game in productive areas will hasten the degradation of the area. Or it won't be long untill the vacuum created is filled with predators.

Which is pretty much what happened in OMP.