grizzly defence question

[Fred1]

Holy crap... Just take the 308 and the spray and go hunting man!! I work in grizz country all the time, chit sometimes I even hunt them... Now if these bears were out hunting and killing us there wouldn't be a forester, berry picker, tree hugger or grow-op operator left in the Kootenays!! Im not saying bear attacks don't happen, they most certainly do, but don't over think it too much. Get out there pay attention to the signs and keep aware as best you can. Get a little concerned after you pull the trigger and have your game on the ground - this would be a good time to hurry - gut, load and get out! You should be more worried getting in your car everyday and driving to work than getting a bite from a bear. Get out there, be smart, be aware and enjoy it! Oh, if you do have the Kevlar storm trooper suit, I wold wear it - cause that would be soooo cool!!!!!

[jtred]

I live and hunt in the Kootenays (the past eight years anyhow before that it was central foothills country SW of Edson, also grizzly country) and although it pays to be careful you don't need to be paranoid. While scouting pack a defender if you have one, I don't so I pack bear spray. While day hunting I don't always carry bear spray since I already have the rifle, usually in hand. While backpack hunting and camping overnight I always have both bear spray and a rifle. If in the very,very rare case it happens to be a predatory attack at night while I'm snugged up tight in my mummy bag I'm probably screwed, think burrito but the rifle and spray are there in the tent with me. I don't get too worked up about it though when you think about how many thousands of people spend countless hours in the bush each year and how many attacks are there? More likely to get in a car accident on the way to your hunting area or take a tumble down a mountain then be targeted by a bear.

[Pioneerman]

To use spray first and then gun makes no sense, if you are that close, you do not have time to swap to another line of defense. If the wind is blowing in your face, what good is a mist in the air going to do other than affect you, or the taste of you ? And for the above comment on how hard it is to be ready with a firearm, to me that makes little sense. Why have the safety on and no round in the chamber ? To aim at something that is coming straight for you should be easier than crossing your path, so aiming should not be an issue. To think bear spray in a Velcro pouch pulling it out, removing the lock and aiming after the danger gets very close does not seem reasonable . If you are somewhere that you are not allowed firearms, then of course that is only option. I rather fire shot into ground ,making a loud boom to scar off an attack first

[604ksmith]

To use spray first and then gun makes no sense, if you are that close, you do not have time to swap to another line of defense. If the wind is blowing in your face, what good is a mist in the air going to do other than affect you, or the taste of you ? And for the above comment on how hard it is to be ready with a firearm, to me that makes little sense. Why have the safety on and no round in the chamber ? To aim at something that is coming straight for you should be easier than crossing your path, so aiming should not be an issue. To think bear spray in a Velcro pouch pulling it out, removing the lock and aiming after the danger gets very close does not seem reasonable . If you are somewhere that you are not allowed firearms, then of course that is only option. I rather fire shot into ground ,making a loud boom to scar off an attack first

By shooting second, I meant that spray should be good enough. If it isn't AND you have some second miracle chance, then shoot at the bear as it spins somewhere around you in utter pain/blindness.

Spray may not work 100% of the time, but if it works, it's said to work instantly. Even a .458wm won't kill instantly, and thats why I would recommend using spray first.

[Foxton Gundogs]

Seeing as though I was the guy who posted the Moose incident with spray yesterday, I'll chime in.

I think SofaKing was spot on about commenting on your confidence level given you're already questioning the .308. For that very reason I would take your shotgun loaded with 3 inch slugs. The added weight will be far surpassed by your added sense of confidence, and the extra enjoyment you'll get out of your trip as you won't be looking over your shoulder the entire time. Although, checking your surroundings often is still a smart thing to do.

That being said, and with no experience to back this up...my gut instinct tells me the best strategy would be spray first, and IF you get the chance and are still in imminent danger, shoot to kill second. I just can't see a bear dying quickly enough to stop a potential deadly attack from gunshots, whereas I can see a bear becoming blind or incapacitated by spray almost instantly.

It's reaction time and time it takes to take off safety, chamber a round, shoulder the rifle, aiming at a moving target charging 40 miles per hour at you and getting a kill shot vs grabbing a can of spray off your hip. I recall hearing about after a number of serious attacks on hunters being found without a shot fired or cartridge chambered.

I do have a 'bit' of experience and this kind of well meaning info is likely to get a man killed if push actually comes to shove. Here is just one of the flaws. if you are aware of the bear before it charges you have time to ready your rifle and aim, if the charge is not a bluff and enters your 'protection zone' of 25 yds you are set and ready to start firing, most any 1/2 decent shot can hit a 8"x14"(frontal kill zone) area if they are ready to shoot. Same scenario, you have your pepper spray out and ready, you still have to wait till the bear is 5 or 6 yards(effective range of spray) before you can unleash it, that is way to close to stop an adrenalin charged bear moving at full speed. If you are taken by surprise well neither will do you much good.
BBD, you sum it up perfectly.

[Ohwildwon]

If you encounter a charging Boar Grizzly defending a kill, I highly doubt Bear Spray will do jack shit...

[Ambush]

People can speculate and postulate all they want, but the actual evidence from years of compiled data clearly shows that spray results in fewer and less traumatic injuries then whenguns are involved.

Use whatever makes you feel good. But really, what you would use IF you were ever attacked is not evidence that it is better.

Mpotzold should be along any minute now with many cut and paste links to prove me wrong. But all those attacks were included in the study.

[604ksmith]

First off, I like this debate. A lot of good points have been raised.

However, I think we need to make a distinction between a charge, and an attack.

If a bear is 50 yards away and charges, I would agree that most people should shoulder a rifle and get ready to shoot. A rifle, specifically a .308, is both quick enough and powerful enough to kill. It's just a matter of how quick/accurate of a shot you can be in the 2-3 seconds it takes a bear to move 50 yards.

If a bear is already within a very close distance and a charge is really just one lunge away from an attack (physical contact), I would strongly debate that a rifle is too slow, and that the one shot you're likely to rush off isn't worth relying on. In this case, I would therefore recommend spray as with my personal practice, I can locate the spray on my hip, raise it, and be ready to spray in about 1 second. Whether spray works or not, I'm willing to bet it does, and it would almost instantly. Much quicker than blood loss induced unconciousness.

[Foxton Gundogs]

First off, I like this debate. A lot of good points have been raised.

However, I think we need to make a distinction between a charge, and an attack.

If a bear is 50 yards away and charges, I would agree that most people should shoulder a rifle and get ready to shoot. A rifle, specifically a .308, is both quick enough and powerful enough to kill. It's just a matter of how quick/accurate of a shot you can be in the 2-3 seconds it takes a bear to move 50 yards.

If a bear is already within a very close distance and a charge is really just one lunge away from an attack (physical contact), I would strongly debate that a rifle is too slow, and that the one shot you're likely to rush off isn't worth relying on. In this case, I would therefore recommend spray as with my personal practice, I can locate the spray on my hip, raise it, and be ready to spray in about 1 second. Whether spray works or not, I'm willing to bet it does, and it would almost instantly. Much quicker than blood loss induced unconciousness.

1 second is will be about 0.5 seconds to slow sorry but that's a fact if the bear as you said one lunge away, rifle or spray ypu are probably hooped. But as others have said take your 308 and go have fun you have more chance of being killed in a traffic accident on the way to the mountain.

[.330 Dakota]

I will guarantee you that the spray will turn him at a minimum,,,bears usually charge with their mouth wide open,,,spray will suck the oxygen out of them. I know one fellow that had a charging sow actually drop when hit with spray and it gave him enough time to vacate the area. Bear lived, He lived--win/win
Old schoolers say shoot,,,spray does work Ive seen it,,,and its faster than a firearm. Good spray is effective to 25-30 feet,,