Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
One thing I think everyone should consider is the Mule deer are obviously in decline. So in my opinion maybe just target Whitetail for a few years, and go out of your way to harvest at least one wolf. If every avid Deer hunter went out of his way to just take one wolf a season . this would have huge spin off affects on the deer population. If not a wolf then a cougar. I live on Haida Gwaii and am planning a wolf hunting trip here with my boys to Francois lake in February. I was Muley hunting there this year and saw way more wolf sign then deer. If we all wait for the government to jar loose with a wolf cull its gonna be to late. Make the time and effort. Get off the couch this time off year and go make a difference. Honestly how many of us just sit around and talk about the wolf problem yet make no effort to go harvest a few. I am certainly guilty of this. If anyone can point me in the right direction or give me any pointers I am all ears.
Also have zero doe season anywhere for Mulies. Leave the does alone .
Think of how much time some of us spend on this stupid computer. If we put that same amount of time into hunting a predator . well just an Idea.
have a nice week. Plan that wolf hunt with your buds. Its alot of fun to hunt a wolf.
Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dana
Personally, if we don't do anything about the predators, no amount of habitat is going to fix the mess we are in. Here is my take. Last summer, epic fire year, which I believe, just created some epic habitat. From my observations after the 03 fires, it took a couple years to really start seeing the benifits to mule deer. Then, wham, they started to go. And so did the hunting. I suspect the same will happen in much of the burns from 2017. But....With super high wolf populations, where are the dogs heading for? I am sure they were licking their chops all summer as they breathed in that smoke like the rest of us. To have these burns truly be productive, we need to hammer on those dogs instead of letting them take advantage of the new food source that will hit the ground each and every spring. Fawn recruitment is key. We need to gets those fawns to the point of having fawns and then those fawns having fawns and on and on we goes. If we let the preds fill their bellies, we will never get back what we once had. Doesn't matter how good the habitat. I say that in all honesty. I have seen top notch areas get eaten so bad, they are now almost void of all animals, not just the ones we hunt. If we continue to say, nope, nothing we can do. No political will. Nope nope nope. We are then just sitting on our hands watching everything go in the toilet. To be honest, I don't think there has ever been much political will for predator management in this province in my lifetime. The wolf cull in the 80's and the Paul Watson sega was all very dramatized with the government of the day caving way to fast. Probably wasn't much political will for it in the first place. So what do we do? I think we have at least go down fighting. Proguide is onto something and I totally support him. He is at least doing something about it and making differences for individual animals. A very good place to start. I think the biases of the past need to be put aside and I believe First Nations hold the key to turning the tide if we work with them instead of the constant blame game. I also believe the Forest Industry would be more than willing to help as the entire industry from Planning to Development to Logging is chalked full of hunters who actually care about the future of our wildlife and our hunting heritage. I think the blame game needs to stop and concrete solutions need to see action instead of just talk. That, my friend, is my personal view. I know there are plenty of super smart hunters out there that have some great ideas. Instead of bashing them telling them that won't work, maybe it is time to hear them out instead of hearing the same old same old from the same old same old.
YEP..What I am seeing right now ..predator kills and not fussy...WT, Mule and sheep
Before we talk about killing more whitetails, we need to knock predator number way down.
Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
It just sucks when, in my opinion, the big culprit to our future problems, is the wolf and one of the big things the ministry has done, is not reinstate a cull program, and I doubt they ever will.
So far, in the R3 MU's I hunt, I have seen wolf sign, plenty of it, but I am still see the numbers of MD, pretty much as
the same as even before the wolves showed up.
And with the amount of fawns that I have seen with these does, everthing looks great, atleast til mid December.
Still see lots of spikes, 2pt and 3 pts as well.
In other words, all looks fine around there.
But, I do worry what a bunch of years will do with the wolves, especially right now with the snowfall, when I think they are at their peak of success.
Other then that, the closing of R5 sure added a lot of traffic, a lot.
I'm not saying that just because there is 3X as many hunters there, that 3X as many bucks get taken, but, due to R5 being closed, I am fairly certain a few more 4pts are taken because of the extra traffic.
That what concerns me the most about some R3 MU's sustainability, when we have one area right next to it closed?
And the biggest concern is a that logging up there, it changed things, and even the local FN I talk to, even acknowledge it, and that was also before the dogs.
Are there any positives, yup, that big fire, but there are a hell of a lot of roads all over the place, so nonoe really needs to walk more then 10 minutes until they hit another road, so, until things green up, I am not sure what the outcome will be?, but I am certain it will be better then it was.
Another thing I notice about Hunters, and they are like wolves in a way.
They will go annually to the same areas to hunt, most likely due to previous successes.
But, when things get slow, and the game appears less abundant, just like wolves, many hunters move on elsewhere.
I doubt that many areas are "over hunted" (some yes), and when it gets slow, so does the pressure.
When it comes to LM's, well they go where the species they are hunting.
MD, yup, R3, and many around Princeton for the weekend, and R5.
Elk R4 and Moose R5 and up, some in R3.
In other words, you cant stop people from hunting what it is they want to hunt.
R5 closed for years now, for 10 days, yet, it sounds like there is no info on how successful it has been.
It's been long enough now to have had "positive effects" if it indeed did.
Yup, you can go to 1 MD limit, I don't care, but remember this also folks.
I only intend to hunt 1 MD annually anyways, and so do all my partners, me + 4.
So there is 5 of us, that generally eat tag soup annually anyways.
Not one of us pursues dinks, unless it is the last day to hunt, and then it is only 1, but much of the time, he gets passed on.
So, don't think every guy and gal with a gun up there is going to take the 1st 4pt they see!
How many of Us are out there? and if it is a good majority who do not shoot at the 1st legal buck,
then ask yourselves "will decreasing the bag limit matter"???
I highly doubt that the max limit of MD are taken anyways per year by each hunter.
So, limit to 1, but it you wont find a change when I am out there, or my partners, but ask yourself, if not that many are taking more then 1, then why are the MD disappearing.??
Are hunters really shooting up all the valleys ??.
Even some here have admitted that their opinion has changed from just a few short years ago.
So, what changed as far as what hunters did in the past few years??
But, what other factors have been going on....Preds, Logging, Beetle Kill, and some Regions having closures.
Hmmmm.....
Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
Parts of region 5 are not the only place that fell shy of the 20% goal it’s just the only region that made an attempt to do anything about it
See the claim of a 20% min is kind of a farce as part of BCs management is to not show concern till it hits the low teens for ratio. BC does not truly have a 20% min other then on paper
Outside of the small adjustment to region 5 when low ratios are found basically they take note and proceed as normal and hope it changes. Combined that with some MUs going years between counts basically things are neglected
Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wild one
Parts of region 5 are not the only place that fell shy of the 20% goal it’s just the only region that made an attempt to do anything about it
See the claim of a 20% min is kind of a farce as part of BCs management is to not show concern till it hits the low teens for ratio. BC does not truly have a 20% min other then on paper
Outside of the small adjustment to region 5 when low ratios are found basically they take note and proceed as normal and hope it changes. Combined that with some MUs going years between counts basically things are neglected
Here is my whole point, and it surprises me that nobody, on both sides of the fence in these discussions, has posted up any new numbers/%'s.
It's been long enough, so, "have the numbers gone up significantly in R5"?.
My concern is this:
If they have not gone up, or made any change or much of a difference, then shouldn't we all realize that maybe the issue wasn't hunting.
And, were they finding that many of the Does were "not bred", thus the closure?
Basically, if they stated, well, we only have a 10:100 buck:doe ratio, and only 50:100 fawn doe ratio, then hell yes,
brakes need to be put on.
But, what is happening....did it make a difference.
Or, should we possibly be alarmed that something else was going on, and whatever that is, could effect not just R5.
Now, as for years without counts....now that is an issue.
Sounds to me, and not just from this thread, but other's as well, that it sounds like we need a bit more counting of inventory going on.
And while there up there flying, maybe pack a few bullets along:grin:
Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bugle M In
Here is my whole point, and it surprises me that nobody, on both sides of the fence in these discussions, has posted up any new numbers/%'s.
It's been long enough, so, "have the numbers gone up significantly in R5"?.
My concern is this:
If they have not gone up, or made any change or much of a difference, then shouldn't we all realize that maybe the issue wasn't hunting.
And, were they finding that many of the Does were "not bred", thus the closure?
Basically, if they stated, well, we only have a 10:100 buck:doe ratio, and only 50:100 fawn doe ratio, then hell yes,
brakes need to be put on.
But, what is happening....did it make a difference.
Or, should we possibly be alarmed that something else was going on, and whatever that is, could effect not just R5.
Now, as for years without counts....now that is an issue.
Sounds to me, and not just from this thread, but other's as well, that it sounds like we need a bit more counting of inventory going on.
And while there up there flying, maybe pack a few bullets along:grin:
I don't know if you noticed, but Region 5 just got hammered by wolves for the last 10 years. And the hammering still continues. So, no, the numbers have not gone up.
Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wild one
Parts of region 5 are not the only place that fell shy of the 20% goal it’s just the only region that made an attempt to do anything about it
See the claim of a 20% min is kind of a farce as part of BCs management is to not show concern till it hits the low teens for ratio. BC does not truly have a 20% min other then on paper
Outside of the small adjustment to region 5 when low ratios are found basically they take note and proceed as normal and hope it changes. Combined that with some MUs going years between counts basically things are neglected
based on your 100s of posts, sounds like you should be the one managing all the deer in the province and all would be perfect
Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gamebuster
based on your 100s of posts, sounds like you should be the one managing all the deer in the province and all would be perfect
Nope no such thing as perfect
I am no expert just have enough knowledge to see more then BS being flogged here commonly
Don’t need to support any of my opinions I only want people to realize there is more than what is commonly pushed as the only way
Yes I do realize I can be a bit much when I have had enough
Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wild one
Nope no such thing as perfect
I am no expert just have enough knowledge to see more then BS being flogged here commonly
Don’t need to support any of my opinions I only want people to realize there is more than what is commonly pushed as the only way
Yes I do realize I can be a bit much when I have had enough
Curious wild one, are you a wildlife Biologist?
Re: Mule Deer Restrictions
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wild one
Nope no such thing as perfect
I am no expert just have enough knowledge to see more then BS being flogged here commonly
Don’t need to support any of my opinions I only want people to realize there is more than what is commonly pushed as the only way
Yes I do realize I can be a bit much when I have had enough
Can you explain what BS is being flogged here and by who ? I'm curious