Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tracker
so when you shot that female ,you also killed its kittens. that's why we go after the toms.. you like big muley bucks and I like big toms..
just out of curiosity would only shooting big toms not make the cat population more dense? Do large toms not kill kittens as a lion would do? Therefore removing more cats from the system? . I’m not being a smart ass I’m just curious as I do not know.
Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dougan
just out of curiosity would only shooting big toms not make the cat population more dense? Do large toms not kill kittens as a lion would do? Therefore removing more cats from the system? . I’m not being a smart ass I’m just curious as I do not know.
That's what happened in the north okanagan/ monashee in the past , not sure how many cat hunters there are now . I used to know several now I can't think of any .... maybe 1
Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Transient toms are the kitten killers...established dominant Tom has his girls.
Large cat biologists suggested that to crash a cougar population you kill females and dominant Toms. The transient Toms will contribute by killing any kits or at least the male kits during the chaos of the missing Dominant Tom. And then it starts all over. Many areas harvest is heavy enough that a Tom never can establish himself. It is all transient Toms but all the she’s get knocked up anyway. A cat doesn’t need to be very old to breed successfully.
BC manages for high cougar populations by protecting females.
Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
boxhitch
Just saying, to make a case for making more the need has to be proven
To argue for more ungulates singularly is rather selfish. There are problems in BC for all wildlife to some extent, resource extraction activities and development pressures reach all levels.
Someone mentioned the view from 30,000' ) .
If we want changes to the lumber farming practices, we better be looking beyond deer or moose, and joining hands with other special intetest groups
I am obviously missing something.
I think your narrative of making more ungulates as being selfish is puzzling.
It is more about finding and stopping the key drivers that are evaporating MD off off certain landscapes in this province (this thread is about the Southern Interior MD project)
Making more is not the issue at hand as near 100% pregnancy rates are being achieved.
MD are trying to do their part, yet numbers go down and down.
Box, the issue is to stop the implosion of MD where once robust populations existed.
MD can be perceived as the canary in the coal mine.
Some will nit pick this to death or, on the other hand, get behind something.
Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
horshur
They killed eagles for Marmots...killing Barred Owls for spotted. There is always hope.
You are extremely well versed at pointing fingers, blaming others with little, if ever, anything positive to say.
Always bad decisions being made from your point of view.
Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ourea
You are extremely well versed at pointing fingers, blaming others with little, if ever, anything positive to say.
Always bad decisions being made from your point of view.
I have to agree with Horshur. There is very little to be positive about when it comes to historical game management.......especially in BC. Why would anyone look at this with colored glasses and expect different outcomes.
This study is a credit to people who actually give a dam however it should be painfully obvious to anyone that's been around more than a few decades that development, over population of humans and commerce will trump most attempts to remediate that damage that's been done.
I sincerely hope that I'm wrong about this but I will get my entire net worth that there will be a continued downhill slide (apart from a few upticks in specific areas that will be short lived) for Mule deer in this Province........
Reality sucks Regards,
Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Look, as far as the study portion of this convo goes, it is a great thing to have "right now".
Things have changed a lot from say the 80's.
I think everyone agrees with that?.
This study will atleast shed light on "what the real main issues are" these days.
Lets face it, there is lots of debate as to what the issues are! in the hunting community alone.
And worse, there are lots of different opinions how to deal with it like more regs etc.
So, that part of the study is good!
Now, the bigger issue is not the study itself.
It is, how do you we come up with money and government support to deal with the fixes that are needed from the study.
Ourea already said that's the big issue.
Money and Support, and not from the hunting community.
So whats the arguing about??
Part 2 of our issues has always been the problem.
How the hell do you think we got here in the first place.
Money and support truly is the "real issue"!
Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tracker
so when you shot that female ,you also killed its kittens. that's why we go after the toms.. you like big muley bucks and I like big toms..
To be clear, we trailed my cat for 5-10 kms. and there was no sign of kittens, the tits were dry. Even if she did have some hiding somewhere, they would become food for others, the intent of my hunt was pop reduction, or predator control.
Each to their own though.
Re: Mule deer study in the Okanagan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mark
To be clear, we trailed my cat for 5-10 kms. and there was no sign of kittens, the tits were dry. Even if she did have some hiding somewhere, they would become food for others, the intent of my hunt was pop reduction, or predator control.
Each to their own though.
Good on you mark!
Most of the houndsmen I know see the big picture and have no issues killing females in the situation we are in.
We don’t live in a utopian world with lots of mule deer and lots of big cats running around.
The mulies thank you for contributing to their survival.
SSS