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Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
So I was out in the bush yesterday when I ran into a couple CO’s. They turned on their lights, jumped out of their truck to start talking to us. Before I knew it the second CO (that wasn’t talking to me) opened the back door of my truck and started rifling through my things. Can they do this?
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Had one in Kamloops do it to.me as well. He jumped right onto my pack and went straight for my rifle case. Was pretty pissed off, not with his aggressiveness, but he's lack of give-a-fks and treatment of my property. 10 minutes later, we were on our way again, but definitely left a sour taste
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Do some CO’s actually dislike hunting and hunters?
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
They cannot just look at your property without your permission, however if you say no and they have a suspicion then they call call RCMP in to conduct a search.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
They're "peace officers", so they have all the authority and restrictions to that authority that any other peace officer has. Their standard is "reasonable cause". Only the officer in question will know if they actually had suspicion that you were committing a crime. You can deny them permission to search, but they don't have to listen, and they don't have to tell you what their reasons for searching you are. If they didn't have permission or a reason to be suspicious of you, and/or the contents of your vehicle, they can not use whatever they find, as evidence against you. However, as I've learned well in the past, doing anything to make their jobs more difficult, gives them lots of reasons to make your life more difficult. I probably would ask them nicely what they were looking for, and what their reasons for the search were, if only to just make a mental note of their answers or lack thereof.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
browningboy
They cannot just look at your property without your permission, however if you say no and they have a suspicion then they call call RCMP in to conduct a search.
Yes they can, no they don’t need the RCMP.
Search without warrant
93
A conservation officer or constable may, without a warrant,
(a)
search a person whom he or she believes on reasonable grounds has in his or her possession any wildlife or fish killed, taken or possessed in violation of this Act or the regulations, or about to be illegally exported,
(b)
stop and search a motor vehicle, private or chartered aircraft, boat or other conveyance, in or on which he or she believes on reasonable grounds that wildlife or fish is being carried by a person, and
(c)
enter and search a shop, public market, storehouse, garage, restaurant, hotel, eating house or camp, in or on which he or she believes on reasonable grounds that wildlife or fish is located.
Seizure
94 (1)
A conservation officer or constable may seize wildlife or fish or parts of either wildlife or fish, anything referred to in paragraph (b) and anything found in, on or about a place, building or premises, or in the possession of a person, that might afford evidence of the commission of an offence under this Act, if the conservation officer or constable
(a)
finds in the possession of a person, or in, on or about a place or thing referred to in section 93, wildlife or fish that the conservation officer or constable believes on reasonable grounds was killed, taken or possessed in violation of this Act, or is about to be illegally exported, or
(b)
finds firearms, ammunition, decoys, traps, fishing rods or other devices or materials, implements or appliances for hunting or trapping wildlife or for catching fish, that the conservation officer or constable believes on reasonable grounds were held, kept or used for or in connection with a violation of this Act.
(2)
A conservation officer may seize wildlife or fish, or parts of either wildlife or fish, in a person's possession if the conservation officer believes on reasonable grounds that the right of property in that wildlife is with the government or remains in the government.
(3)
Sections 23 to 24.2 of the Offence Act do not apply in respect of wildlife or fish, or parts of either wildlife or fish, seized under this Act.
Officers empowered to stop vehicles
95 (1)
An officer may, for the purposes of this Act, stop a motor vehicle, private or chartered aircraft or boat or other vehicle to determine whether or not the occupants of the vehicle have been hunting, trapping or angling, and to obtain information about wildlife or game fish possessed by them.
(2)
A person commits an offence under subsection (1) if the person
(a)
fails to stop,
(b)
fails to identify himself or herself when requested to do so by the officer,
(c)
refuses to give information respecting hunting or fishing, or
(d)
being the driver or operator of a motor vehicle, in or on which there is wildlife or game fish or an article or device that may be used for hunting, trapping or fishing, fails, refuses or neglects to stop his or her motor vehicle when signalled or requested to stop by an officer who is in his or her uniform of office or displays his or her official badge.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
BC Wildlife Act ....
Part 1
Section 89 - 96
Have been stopped by a few creepy CO's ....
If you are stopped ..... always ask for their identification also.
You may have to ask a few times. Most carry a business card.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Sounds like if you are driving down a gravel road, you will get searched. Or if you wear camo, you will get searched. Seems "reasonable" to me.....
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
That's what C.O.s do, part of the job, you have a license plate number, if a C.O. has been phoned by someone and reported a pick-up and something happened?
-- depends what it is, where it is, who it is and if a back up is required? now
-- safety for C.O.s is number 1 concern all the time
Jel -- pull over - stop - and listen - then go from there, be calm, be respectful, be polite -- your vehicle might look like the one they want?
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
And for those who think that CO’s have more powers than police officers in the bush; this is the definition of and Officer in the Wildlife Act:
"officer" means
(a)
a constable, a conservation officer, the director, an assistant director or a regional manager,
(a.1)
subject to subsection (3), a park ranger appointed under the Park Act, or
(b)
an employee of the government designated by name or position as an officer, by regulation of the minister;
"constable" means an officer of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police or either of the following as defined in the Police Act:
(a)
a designated constable;
(b)
a municipal constable;
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jack Russell
Sounds like if you are driving down a gravel road, you will get searched. Or if you wear camo, you will get searched. Seems "reasonable" to me.....
Really ? SEARCHED for what ? under what Probable grounds ? RJ
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
-- As soon as you resist or start arguing, or playing tuff guy, with an authority figure as a C.O. when pulled over, you can be ordered to obey!
Jello Hello -- Outta the car long hair! --
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
For the most part every piece of legislation a CO, or any officer enforces, will have a several sections on the officers authority or powers under that legislation. If you going out to do something that requires a license, permit or has laws/regulations governing it it's a good idea to know what you can/can't do and what officers can and can't do.
If you can post on Hunt BC, you have the skills to look up the legislation your self. Interpreting legislation can be challenging, not IKEA furniture instructions challenging, but it's not really complex once you spend some time at it and understand how legislation is written - it's all done pretty much the same way. The sections are often inter-linked so read more than just the narrow section on what you want to know.
Looking for a answer on the internet to a question like officer authority is a perilous way educate yourself. "My buddy told me I could" is not really a great defense.
Good Place to start is BC Laws: http://www.bclaws.ca/civix/content/c...tes/browse.xsl
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Pemby_mess
They're "peace officers", so they have all the authority and restrictions to that authority that any other peace officer has. Their standard is "reasonable cause". Only the officer in question will know if they actually had suspicion that you were committing a crime. You can deny them permission to search, but they don't have to listen, and they don't have to tell you what their reasons for searching you are. If they didn't have permission or a reason to be suspicious of you, and/or the contents of your vehicle, they can not use whatever they find, as evidence against you. However, as I've learned well in the past, doing anything to make their jobs more difficult, gives them lots of reasons to make your life more difficult. I probably would ask them nicely what they were looking for, and what their reasons for the search were, if only to just make a mental note of their answers or lack thereof.
Reminds me of the bad old days when the August Long Weekend "Tulameen Days" were at their worst ( some would say finest ) and there were a lot of really badly behaving folks in Town.
A contingent of RCMP spent the weekend here but to supplement them there were other "Peace Officers" including CO's and Federal Fisheries Officers patrolling the streets. Was kinda funny watching a Fisheries Officer writing out a ticket to a drunk walking on the Street with an open beer in his hand.
Yes, all "Peace Officers" have broad authority.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steve W
For the most part every piece of legislation a CO, or any officer enforces, will have a several sections on the officers authority or powers under that legislation. If you going out to do something that requires a license, permit or has laws/regulations governing it it's a good idea to know what you can/can't do and what officers can and can't do.
This is such good advice, especially in the Internet age where people like to preach opinion as fact.
I used to be fairly active on some car forums, and the same thing would constantly happen. Edmonton had one with resident officers that would post/answer questions. Without a doubt someone would ask something, eight people would chime in with their wrong opinion, then an officer would just quote the Motor Vehicle Act.
It's like the give a man a fish vs teach a man to fish proverb, if you learn to find your own information you're in such a better position, saying 'SuperHunter6969 online told me I could XYZ." Isn't going to do anyone any favors in court.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
93 (b) is pretty all encompassing. I usually find that if I play nice then they do too.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcsteve
Yes they can, no they don’t need the RCMP.
Search without warrant
93
A conservation officer or constable may, without a warrant,
(a)
search a person whom he or she believes on reasonable grounds has in his or her possession any wildlife or fish killed, taken or possessed in violation of this Act or the regulations, or about to be illegally exported,
(b)
stop and search a motor vehicle, private or chartered aircraft, boat or other conveyance, in or on which he or she believes on reasonable grounds that wildlife or fish is being carried by a person, and
(c)
enter and search a shop, public market, storehouse, garage, restaurant, hotel, eating house or camp, in or on which he or she believes on reasonable grounds that wildlife or fish is located.
Seizure
94 (1)
A conservation officer or constable may seize wildlife or fish or parts of either wildlife or fish, anything referred to in paragraph (b) and anything found in, on or about a place, building or premises, or in the possession of a person, that might afford evidence of the commission of an offence under this Act, if the conservation officer or constable
(a)
finds in the possession of a person, or in, on or about a place or thing referred to in section 93, wildlife or fish that the conservation officer or constable believes on reasonable grounds was killed, taken or possessed in violation of this Act, or is about to be illegally exported, or
(b)
finds firearms, ammunition, decoys, traps, fishing rods or other devices or materials, implements or appliances for hunting or trapping wildlife or for catching fish, that the conservation officer or constable believes on reasonable grounds were held, kept or used for or in connection with a violation of this Act.
(2)
A conservation officer may seize wildlife or fish, or parts of either wildlife or fish, in a person's possession if the conservation officer believes on reasonable grounds that the right of property in that wildlife is with the government or remains in the government.
(3)
Sections 23 to 24.2 of the Offence Act do not apply in respect of wildlife or fish, or parts of either wildlife or fish, seized under this Act.
Officers empowered to stop vehicles
95 (1)
An officer may, for the purposes of this Act, stop a motor vehicle, private or chartered aircraft or boat or other vehicle to determine whether or not the occupants of the vehicle have been hunting, trapping or angling, and to obtain information about wildlife or game fish possessed by them.
(2)
A person commits an offence under subsection (1) if the person
(a)
fails to stop,
(b)
fails to identify himself or herself when requested to do so by the officer,
(c)
refuses to give information respecting hunting or fishing, or
(d)
being the driver or operator of a motor vehicle, in or on which there is wildlife or game fish or an article or device that may be used for hunting, trapping or fishing, fails, refuses or neglects to stop his or her motor vehicle when signalled or requested to stop by an officer who is in his or her uniform of office or displays his or her official badge.
Well I never knew that, thanks for the clarification!
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
No excuses now, bc stevie ray vonn folks -- every offence you can imagine clarified - bcsteve reeves --
Jelly - No excuses now -- how now brown cow?
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Bc Steve posted the gospel. It’s pretty straight forward. If they believe you are hunting or that you have wildlife in your possession...anywhere other than a dwelling house (requires a warrant) you are subject to search. This applies to fishery act stuff as well. It’s actually more sweeping search powers then police are issued under the Criminal Code.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gunner Staal
Bc Steve posted the gospel. It’s pretty straight forward. If they believe you are hunting or that you have wildlife in your possession...anywhere other than a dwelling house (requires a warrant) you are subject to search. This applies to fishery act stuff as well. It’s actually more sweeping search powers then police are issued under the Criminal Code.
Ive been stopped and casually searched while not hunting or fishing a couple times. Where does their power to search end, after their initial grounds for the search based on wildlife is satisfied? Like I assume they can't start looking for wildlife, but then broaden the scope to looking for anything and everything else? Or can they?
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
I have several trail cams I check on a regular basis. In my area, I have 3 cougars and a large sow bear with 3 cubs plus probably a 2 year old bear that I have pictures of. I would like to know what would happen if I carried my gun now for”protection “ if any of these animals charged me while checking these trail cams. Would C/O’s nail me for killing an animal out of season?
Thoughts?
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bloodbath
I have several trail cams I check on a regular basis. In my area, I have 3 cougars and a large sow bear with 3 cubs plus probably a 2 year old bear that I have pictures of. I would like to know what would happen if I carried my gun now for”protection “ if any of these animals charged me while checking these trail cams. Would C/O’s nail me for killing an animal out of season?
Thoughts?
Not really sure what your post has to do with this thread, but since you've asked the question...
If your highly unlikely scenario takes place, my thought is.....
"Don't tell the CO your HBC username". :)
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
When the lights came on the investigation started. That's my guess. Do you recall a few years ago just out of Prince George, A cop saw a vehicle come onto the highway from a logging road. He suspected the driver of poaching so pulled him over. He called for a CO who went up the road expecting to find a carcass. Well they found a body and it was a young girl he had murdered. The name escapes me but she was legally blind if I recall. had he not been stopped he might have gotten away with murder. just sayin....
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
It's not like a cop can walk up to your car and just open the door and start looking through it. They have to have permission or probable cause. I would have thought any peace officer would have the same basic guidelines.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
It all depends on the officers ability to articulate where you could be storing wildlife or fish. Which when you think about it, can be just about anywhere in your vehicle, camp or in your personal gear ie: pack. All depends on the totality if the circumstances. Where you are....what season it is.....what kind of game in the area etc etc. If during the course of their search for say, a salmon.....they find drugs in your backpack, you will then be arrested for drugs and the search broadens. They’re not the gestapo, but if you give them reason to search they will. I’m my opinion they should. Doesn’t bother me if someone wants to rifle through my 10 day old sheep gaunch. I highly advise against it however!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Pemby_mess
Ive been stopped and casually searched while not hunting or fishing a couple times. Where does their power to search end, after their initial grounds for the search based on wildlife is satisfied? Like I assume they can't start looking for wildlife, but then broaden the scope to looking for anything and everything else? Or can they?
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gunner Staal
It all depends on the officers ability to articulate where you could be storing wildlife or fish. Which when you think about it, can be just about anywhere in your vehicle, camp or in your personal gear ie: pack. All depends on the totality if the circumstances. Where you are....what season it is.....what kind of game in the area etc etc. If during the course of their search for say, a salmon.....they find drugs in your backpack, you will then be arrested for drugs and the search broadens. They’re not the gestapo, but if you give them reason to search they will. I’m my opinion they should. Doesn’t bother me if someone wants to rifle through my 10 day old sheep gaunch. I highly advise against it however!
yeah, that makes sense I guess. All my interactions with CO's have been really proffesional and relatively painless. I wouldn't be overly concerned about a quick reasonably specific search.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
j270wsm
It's not like a cop can walk up to your car and just open the door and start looking through it. They have to have permission or probable cause. I would have thought any peace officer would have the same basic guidelines.
Their authority doesn’t come from who they are, it comes from what Act they are enforcing. A cop can’t pull you over under the Controlled Drugs and Subtance Act but he sure can pull you over under the Motor Vehicle Act.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Just a thought. If you're pulled over and the officer has reasonable grounds to search your vehicle and finds nothing, what were his grounds? I know if anyone asks to search my vehicle it's a hard no. Experiences like that are worth a phone call to their office and maybe a complaint.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
-- If your pulled over by the C.O.s or at a road check, pull over stop, turn truck off and roll window down, keep your hands in plain visible sight.
- If you are honest and have nothing to hide, act accordingly --
Jello Mello -- tone of voice? Keep it mello -- attitude ? of gratitude at all latitudes --> Carry on my wayward son -->
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bustercluck
Just a thought. If you're pulled over and the officer has reasonable grounds to search your vehicle and finds nothing, what were his grounds? I know if anyone asks to search my vehicle it's a hard no. Experiences like that are worth a phone call to their office and maybe a complaint.
If he had reasonable ground to search and you were in compliance, that’s great, you both did your job! The standard is not “beyond a reasonable doubt”, that’s the standard for conviction.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
I don't think there's a scenario where an officer asks you to search your vehicle, you say 'no', and they say 'ok' and let you go. Saying 'no' or questioning their grounds or authority is enough to cause suspicion, and thus, reasonable cause. If you have nothing to hide, you have no reason to not comply.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jelvis
Jello Mello -- tone of voice? Keep it mello -- attitude ? of gratitude at all latitudes --> Carry on my wayward son -->
Jelly, you have a beautiful way with words
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Thanks Linksman313 I appreciate your comment, and I want to say we all should give bc steve a round of applause for his sharing such valuable information for HBC members to link up to.
Jel -- give a hand to bcsteve and hope he keeps up the factual info -- it clears the water -- gives Hope -- brings down the Barrieres --
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kootenaihunter
I don't think there's a scenario where an officer asks you to search your vehicle, you say 'no', and they say 'ok' and let you go. Saying 'no' or questioning their grounds or authority is enough to cause suspicion, and thus, reasonable cause. If you have nothing to hide, you have no reason to not comply.
While COs have some pretty far reaching powers, this attitude makes me scratch my head. Do you want the police to just search you whenever and wherever they want? So what if you have nothing to hide, what about freedom and not living in a police state?
Know your rights and at least stand up for them. Freedom doesn't last if no one stands up for it.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kootenaihunter
I don't think there's a scenario where an officer asks you to search your vehicle, you say 'no', and they say 'ok' and let you go. Saying 'no' or questioning their grounds or authority is enough to cause suspicion, and thus, reasonable cause. If you have nothing to hide, you have no reason to not comply.
Asking nicely what gave them their reasonable grounds to initiate a search is fully reasonable on your part though. Take note of their answer and learn from it if you can. I don't think they have to give you any answer either, but that could be telling in it of itself. Society doesn't work very well if suspicion of its citizens heightens to the level where you can't do anything without being worried about unwarranted searches and scrutiny.
Ive often thought about this in the context of firearms. Just having a license, seems to give them reasonable cause to suspect you are carrying a weapon, and the authority to inspect it, or in other words search your house, vehicle, and person. Given there is no defined scope on things like random DUI check stops, I always feel like it puts me in a vulnerable position in regard to unreasonable search. Especially when they are in the habit of asking me all kinds of questions that have nothing to do with the scope of their check stop, and where my natural reaction is NYB. Though anecdotally I feel like the RCMP's behaviour has greatly improved over the last few years in relation to their general duties policing citizens.
There is something to be said about not interfering with police intuition as well. But strictly enforced protocols probably help with the formation of that intuition, more than they hinder it most of the time.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Too many scenario's to go thru to cover all stops and searches and why it happened and so forths.
-- that's why we have finger prints, otherwise a lot of innocent people being found guilty --
You and I have both made I'D. mistakes, thinking it was someone for sure! Then seeing it isn't.
Jel -- finger prints, breathalyzers -- etc -- people make mistakes -- sometimes people think there 100 % right and their dead wrong! Everyone does.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jelvis
Thanks Linksman313 I appreciate your comment, and I want to say we all should give bc steve a round of applause for his sharing such valuable information for HBC members to link up to.
Jel -- give a hand to bcsteve and hope he keeps up the factual info -- it clears the water -- gives Hope -- brings down the Barrieres --
I agree - thanks to bc steve!
and I also often enjoy your poetry jelvis
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Again, ask for their ID or business card. Know who you are dealing with.
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Re: Conservation Officers: What is their authority to conduct searches?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanb
While COs have some pretty far reaching powers, this attitude makes me scratch my head. Do you want the police to just search you whenever and wherever they want? So what if you have nothing to hide, what about freedom and not living in a police state?
Know your rights and at least stand up for them. Freedom doesn't last if no one stands up for it.
I've always asked the reason when I've been searched, well aware of that right to ask. I'm also well aware of the authority of RCMP, COs, and CBSA. I've never felt that complying with a search (while finding out the reason) is an attack on my freedom or the beginning of a police state.
I'm more referring to those that take an obstructionist view and question the authority or legality of a search.