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moose hunter
02-17-2006, 04:58 PM
i know that a 270 or 30-06 would kill a grizzly with proper placement this year me and my dad are going moose hunting out the mgregor and im going to have my 7mm i think if needed my 7mm will drop a grizz on the spot i had some one (not mentioning any names) tell me a 338 is abrely enough for grizzly i think thats the biggest that should be used, and my dad will have his 300 i think the trip will be fine i wouldnt mind seeing a few grizzlies at a distance:mrgreen:

todbartell
02-17-2006, 05:05 PM
any gun you have in your hands is a good one to have if a grizz is after you

that being said for defense, Id want a Marlin lever in 45/70 stoked with hardcast 420 gr.

now if I was out hunting grizz, and needed some more reach, I'd want a 338 Win or bigger, on up to the 416 Rem

NEEHAMA
02-17-2006, 05:23 PM
i hate to be the BEAR of bad news but unless you have ice in your veins you will miss that charging grizz. most people will empty the gun during a charge, and miss every shot. you need a shot gun. nothing has that kind of energy up close and personal. remember to save the last round to shove it in the beast's mouth! you won't miss that one. good luck!

Gateholio
02-17-2006, 05:57 PM
i hate to be the BEAR of bad news but unless you have ice in your veins you will miss that charging grizz. most people will empty the gun during a charge, and miss every shot. you need a shot gun. nothing has that kind of energy up close and personal. remember to save the last round to shove it in the beast's mouth! you won't miss that one. good luck!

Oh boy....:-D

mcrae
02-17-2006, 06:16 PM
I won't comment on the shotgun remark:roll: but I use a .338 Win Mag for hunting bears and as for hitting a charging bear I think its a pretty broad statement to suggest nobody can hit a charging bear with a rifle. If you are a dedicated rifleman and practice with your weapon I think your chances are better than most. If I was to pick a gun just for bear defense it would be a Marlin Guide gun in 45/70 as well. I will use a shotgun for grouse not for stopping a bear.

Johnnybear
02-17-2006, 06:24 PM
Good replies regarding the Marlin's

sealevel
02-17-2006, 07:19 PM
Those guide guns IMO are to short i think in the case of a chargeing grizz one might have a hard time getting on the bear.I think i could put 2 shot into something faster with my single shot browning 45-70 it will not shoot as fast but i think i can sight faster but maybe not at a chargeing grizz.

ratherbefishin
02-17-2006, 07:27 PM
I don't know but I suspect there's not much anyone can do if a grizzly came charging out of the willows-a couple of jumps and it would be on you.I doubt you would even get a shot off.A mad grizzly can cover an awful lot of ground in a very short time.I give them a very wide berth when ever I see one,keep a scrupulously clean camp, wash up after every meal,burn all cans immediately after opening,and don't leave any uneaten food around ever.Grizzlies are best viewed through binoculars a long way away

alremkin
02-17-2006, 07:29 PM
If I was hunting Grizzly I'd use my 416 Remington. I've seen about 600 lbs mountain grizzly shot through the heart and lungs run 200 yards up a 30 degree slope and die a couple minutes later on the other side of the hill. :eek:You might be lucky and kill a griz with one shot to the brain with a 7mm or a spinal shot could take it out too. If the two of you stay together while hunting griz with your 7mm and a 300, you should be ok. Expect to have to shoot the bear at least two times and use the heavist bullets for your caliber like 175 gr and 220 gr using something like a barnes XXX or Swift Bonded core.

sealevel
02-17-2006, 07:52 PM
My cousen shot a grizz up the stickeen 2 years ago with his bow went about 40 yards he didn`t even have backup

BlacktailStalker
02-17-2006, 09:37 PM
I guess the only person who can say what really works is the guy who has been charged by one and killed the grizz or the guy who found the gun and states the caliber of it belonging to the guy who was mauled :)

youngfellla
02-17-2006, 09:58 PM
A 7 Mag with a 175 Partition would work fine. Read Gatehouses grizz hunt story - killed with a 160 X-Bullet that broke both shoulders.

Heart/lung shots will kill a grizz, but remember a grizz's heart beats somewhere around 8 - 10 times a minute, so even if you put one in the vitals they still have plenty of time to make a charge.

Best shots on a grizz are through the shoulders if he is broadside, hopefully breaking both, and if he is facing you, a shot to the base of his hump will put him down.

Barracuda
02-17-2006, 11:24 PM
I use 375 H&H For almost all my hunting . (with the exeption of hound hunting then i use the 30-30 carbine)
I think that being familier with the firearm and working within it abilities is a bit of a lost skill. Most of the high power rounds will do the job in the hands of a capeable shooter but i think of stopping power from 338 and up.

Schmaus
02-17-2006, 11:48 PM
Ah come on as if my 22-250 with 53 grain triple shocks couldn't do the job.:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

elkster
02-18-2006, 12:26 AM
If I'm out hunting grizz, I use my 338, but in camp and in the tent, I have a defender shotgun. first two shells are triple ought to blind and slow down the bear. The last five are ssgs, to make sure he stays down and to give my partner time to use his rifle. Wasn't a grizz, but I put down a big black bear seven or eight feet away from our tent opening with the defender. The long johns had some camo streaks in them after that.:mrgreen:

moose hunter
02-18-2006, 11:35 AM
If I was hunting Grizzly I'd use my 416 Remington. I've seen about 600 lbs mountain grizzly shot through the heart and lungs run 200 yards up a 30 degree slope and die a couple minutes later on the other side of the hill. :eek:You might be lucky and kill a griz with one shot to the brain with a 7mm or a spinal shot could take it out too. If the two of you stay together while hunting griz with your 7mm and a 300, you should be ok. Expect to have to shoot the bear at least two times and use the heavist bullets for your caliber like 175 gr and 220 gr using something like a barnes XXX or Swift Bonded core.

we will be hunitng for moose out the mgregor

Schmaus
02-18-2006, 11:37 AM
Have you guys hunted the McGregor area before?

moose hunter
02-18-2006, 06:25 PM
yes and i saw some tracks that were well ya we were out there a year ago

rrfred
02-18-2006, 07:10 PM
some years ago i had a 200- 225 lb , a spring black bear take me on after a broadside shot where i blew out both of his front legs bones with a 7 mm mag 175 grand slam at 45 yds. he dropped, and then came for me on his hind legs at an amazing rate. i missed shot two as he fell down when the gun was going bang, but as he got up again, rounds three and four tamed him, last at about 12 feet. what saved my butt was lots of practice in field situations before hunting season. if a little dinker bear can do what he did, picture a full grown mountain grizz incoming... practice and use the biggest gun you can shoot well. cheers

Maxx
02-18-2006, 07:22 PM
Speaking from experience, use a Barnes, failsafe or equal, I am a lover of the Nosler Partition for most situations, but the Barnes,failsafe are better matched for Big bears IMO,

The bullet is more important than the calibre ( within reason)

BOOMSTICK
02-18-2006, 09:23 PM
338 Win Mag with a good 250 grain bullet is a minimum fight stopper for grizzly bears. Yes, many bears have been killed with smaller rifles, but when push comes to shove you need big bullets thrown out with lots of energy. The most popular rifles carried by grizz hunting guides in Alaska are 338 Win Mag and 375 H&H. When I guide for grizz, I look to my Ruger No.1 416 Rigby with a stout 400 grain bullet.

Like they say, there's no such thing as being over-gunned for grizzly bears.

moosecaller
02-18-2006, 11:10 PM
I have had to stop 2 bears in my years of hunting 1 black and 1 grizzly. The black was a 6'0" that had mauled 1 of my horses a week earlier and I stopped her charge from 15 feet with a 30-06 M-1 garand 4 shots and down it went probably dead on shot 1 but the finger would not stop squeezing. The grizzly was gut shot by another hunter with a 270 at 125 yards I put 1 into the top of the skull with my 338 using 300grn. silver tips and a second through both shoulders to finish it, it dropped at 45 yards and did not twitch. If I had not remained cool with either of these bears it would not have mattered what I was shooting I would not be telling this story. Incidentally the partner of the fellow who gut shot the grizzly had a 375 and ejected all his rounds without firing a shot at this bear, bad buck fever!

boonerbuck
02-19-2006, 09:36 AM
My bear rifle is will be a 9.3x62 Mauser. It's half complete and I have my Lapua brass in too. A 286 gr. TSX will be the bullet I'll focus on for griz. Didn't get my draw though.

redlegdrake
03-13-2006, 07:51 PM
Browning 10 Ga with 766 grain hollow points. With 2001 ft/pounds at 50 yards. Its not a hunting gun due to the lack of range unless its a sea duck or snow goose. But if you need to stop something. Bigger is better.:grin:

huntwriter
03-13-2006, 10:03 PM
The 30-06 has taken more game animals than any other cartridge in North America and has been used and still is used successfully an almost all North American game animals, including bears.

The 7mm mag is plenty enough gun even for a grizzly. It is not so muche the size of the ammo but the marksmanship that will decide how fast a bear goes down. You can hit a bear with a cannon in the ass and he still will keep on running. Converversely you can hit an elephant right behind the ear with a 30-06 and he drops without making one step.

A few years ago I wittnessed two hunters, both of them empty their magazines of 300mag into a griz and he still was charging. Finally the guide put the bear down with one shot to the noggin, right betwenn the eyes. By closer examination none of the bullets of the two hunters where even close to fatal shots. Incidentally neither of them shot their guns at the range before the hunt.

One of them was scared because his 300mag. kicked like an old mule and the other hunter was bragging what a shot he is and would not need to practice.

CanAm500
03-13-2006, 10:50 PM
Would a 150 gr from a 270 be enough for a bear?

Marc
03-13-2006, 10:59 PM
Yes a 150 gr would be fine for a bear just make sure it's not something that will expand to fast. I took this bear with a 270 and 150 gr bullet spring of 2004. Just make your shot count and don't stop shooting until he either stops or you run out of bullets :D


http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/3Bear_grey_mouth.jpg

lip_ripper00
03-13-2006, 11:04 PM
Would a 150 gr from a 270 be enough for a bear? ya them island bears aint very big:lol:

Foxer
03-13-2006, 11:28 PM
Would a 150 gr from a 270 be enough for a bear?

Depends on what the bear is hunting. Nyuk nyuk nyuk! :)


(heh - ok, i'll go stand in my corner now...)

Gus
03-13-2006, 11:28 PM
I've hunted grizz with a 30-06 and a 300 mag, never getting a shot off mind you, but i haven't felt under gunned. We know that there has been countless grizzlies taken with a bow and arrow, yet there are still some insisting that a 338 is a bare minimum and i get the impression from some that they wouldn't even try it with out something of at least this caliber. I'm not trying to criticize by any means here, I'm just looking for some clarification as to this thoery. I agree completely that when it comes to grizz you cant have to big a gun, and bigger is better, how ever, whats wrong with using a 270 or a 30-06 if this all you have?

youngfellla
03-13-2006, 11:49 PM
Gus, you're absolutely right, an '06 or 300 will definetly kill a grizz. I've hunted them with my 7mm Mag and didn't feel under-gunned.

The reason a lot of hunters feel the 338 Win Mag is minimum for grizz is this - Think about the absolute worst situation you could be in with a po'd grizzly bear, and then think of what gun you would want to have in this situation. A gun that is a true fight-stopper. 338 immediately comes to mind, and for some .375 or bigger, with tough bullets of high sectional density.

Aside from that, one of the biggest grizzlies I have ever seen which ranked very well in the B&C was killed with a 7x57 Mauser 175 Partition bullet in one shot @ 100 yards and the bullet blew through the lungs and out the off-shoulder. As always, shot placement and a stout bullet is the key.

Walksalot
03-14-2006, 06:16 AM
If you feel your rifle will drop a moose then it will certianly drop a bear. A bull moose in the rut can be just as surly as a bear.

mcrae
03-14-2006, 08:27 AM
I will be using a 7saum with 160 Accubonds this spring for my bears and I do have a grizz LEH. I sold my 338 Win Mag last week because I got tired of hauling around a 10 lbs gun and I like to practice with my hunting rifle as much as I can and the .338 just beat me up to much at the range.

I just bought a Sako Finnlight in 338/08 for black bears but I havn't had any practice time with it so I will see how that goes..........

I do believe if you use calibers below the .338 Win Mag shot placement is critical! If the shot is marginal don't take it. And use good premium bullets. I realize this applies to the big calibers too but I found when using the .338 Win Mag I had the power to make shots I wouldn't have tried with my 7SAUM or 7mm08.

If I could handle recoil better( one too many concussions:-) ) I would probably be using a .375 H&H but I can't so I use what I shoot best.

rocksteady
03-14-2006, 09:10 AM
When I got my grizzly I used my '06 with the 180 Winchester failsafes..(Worked for me)

A lot of Grizz hunters get in trouble when they whack one and then go to have a look....

I do it similar to bow hunting, whack em and give them at least 30 mins, an hour is better to pile up....If you can still see them dump a couple extra rounds into em to ensure they are toast.....A couple more bullet holes in the hide isn't gonna make a difference.....It could be too late to put a couple more in once you get up to them and realize they are not dead yet....

NEEHAMA
03-14-2006, 01:26 PM
Any rifle could kill a gizz if you hit it right. trying to find it in the scope at 15 yards is a bit dodgey. i'll hunt them with a rifle but would rather be defending myself with the margine for error forgiving shot gun.

if your heart is racing and your slighlty off your mark with your whole life invested in one last SINGLE bullet...

shortroot
03-14-2006, 02:12 PM
Good answer RS.

I too was successful on a grizz last year. Used my 300 win mag, loaded with 200gr. NABs. First shot dropped him (through front leg and boiler room), second shot hit him as he was getting up slowly (another through the boiler room), then all hell broke loose and I just kept flingin lead into the ball of fur flipping around. The last two rounds in the clip and the first two rounds of the second clip managed two hits (one in the neck and one in the rump). It is hard to hit a bear when it is rolling around, let alone trying to hit a vital area. My theory was to hit mass and create as much damage as possible, I knew my first two shots were good. Then just before he hit some cover he stopped to look back and one more to the boiler room finished him off, he dropped in plain sight, thank goodness since it was a solo hunt. I will continue to empty my clip if the bear is moving. It is easier to patch a hole in the bear than in your hide.

I have an acquaintance who swore by his 7mm. He has had his fair share of successful grizz hunts, from back in the day when you could still buy a tag over the counter.

I also had a friend shoot a nice grizz a couple of years ago with an '06 at less than 50yds while the bear was looking at them. Two guys, one gun, big grizz. From the story I heard, they may have gotten away with one (lucky not to get hurt).

Most guys will recommend a .338 or bigger, and yep, I'd use the biggest gun I could comfortably shoot, but the 300 is my biggest gun. I want a bigger one, but don't have one yet.

Dealing with bears, or any big game animal is situation dependent with regards to having a big enough gun. For most "hunting" situations, nearly all centerfire rifles will pack enough power to kill a big bear. However, turn it into a defensive situation and you might think twice about the .270 your packing. I personally pack what I have available, the 300. If by some chance it were to become a defensive situation, I would rely on my weapon and mind to pull me through, if it isn't enough then that is the outcome (the risk that I am willing to take), when hunting bears your never 100% safe, regardless of the weapon you use.

I've been close to grizz, close enough to make many people tremble, but the key is to remain composed and think. Be aware of your surroundings and situation, and take control. I've hunted with many people who have been in the outdoors for decades, it still amazes me the lack of awareness that many people have for their surroundings. Paying attention to the details around you will help you in your bid to stay alive.

PS, I don't recommend solo grizz hunts. I was young, single and some say foolish:oops: , but what is done is done.

For your moose hunt, pay attention to your surroundings and the signs. Being aware that there are bears in the area and not putting yourself in a dangerous position will ultimately be the safest process. If you choose to put yourself in a position that may increase the likelihood of a bear confrontation then it may not matter what caliber you are packing. Talk things through with your hunting partners about what to do if a bear shows up or attacks you while hunting, knowing what should be done before hand may save your life.

Have fun on your moose hunt.

PGKris
03-15-2006, 05:07 PM
Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement. I hunt in grizzly country. I hunt with a .303 British. I don't feel under-gunned. Personally, I would not shoot a grizzly unless it was charging me. But I don't ever feel under-gunned because I know where my bullet is going when I squeeze off. A well-placed shot from a 30-06 is a lot better than a crappy shot from a 375 H&H thats for damned sure.
This is like asking what is the best calibre for deer. Some will swear by the 30-30, some by the .270 and some by the 30-06.

Foxer
03-15-2006, 05:37 PM
Historically - if you read the specific details about those who have successfully used a gun to defend against an attacking bear you will tend to find that familiarity with the gun and skill is more important to results than calibre or cartridge is, although the second is important too.

In other words - a guy with a 'weak' gun but strong skills will be more likely to survive than the guy with a great gun but little practice.

So - if you're concerned about bears you'd be better off worrying about practicing 'bear attacks' with your rifle than getting a different rifle. A 7mm mag is nothing to sneeze at, even for a griz - Provided the bullet goes where it needs to to do some damage.

youngfellla
03-16-2006, 12:45 AM
A lot of Grizz hunters get in trouble when they whack one and then go to have a look....

That's for sure. One of the biggest problems is when a hunter wounds one and then goes chasing it through the thick stuff. Best thing to do is wait, at least an hour, maybe more, and if he's hit good he'll bleed out. Then go in and have a look, safety off, ready to shoot. A little patience goes a long ways.....

bigwhiteys
03-16-2006, 09:58 AM
My dad has guided many grizz hunters some even with a bow and never carried a sidearm or backup rifle.

It came down to what others have said... Experience, Confidence, And the ability to handle your rifle/bow.

I have a 2 year old Grizzly on my wall that my dad actually beat the S&*T out of with a broom when it was eating the caribou meat off the racks in camp.

It turned on my dad and ran him clear over then a hunter whacked it dead with a good shot.

Cool Story when he tells it.

Happy Hunting!
Carl