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Nimrod
09-23-2008, 07:01 PM
I was expecting some one to post the sting that was set up up off bear creek main on Saturday.
After our morning hunt were going to move. we drove into a cut block and my buddy yells MOOSE
after I identify it as a 3x3 buddy yells BUCK...I'm like WTF where "right there in front of us"
sure enough there ready to bolt was a massive buck,heavy, tall, I put the spotter on it "no man it's a big 3 point" I looked at its face ...??? wait a minute, " it's a set up< thier not real, look they haven't moved"
so we jump back in the truck and drove off wondering where jonny law was hiding.
then a green truck pulls forward from a T intersection and gives us the thumbs up.
after that, feeling kind of violated we fked off . But not before seeing another truck go through, these guys poured out of the truck, gun on the hood of the truck, then you could see them figure it out as well. this time guy in the green truck got out to talk to the group, maybe about the gun on the hood ?
anyway, the whole experience sucked.

phearless
09-23-2008, 07:05 PM
Glad you looked hard at it.
They get a lot of " hunters " like that.
It just doesn't seem right to set someone up like that though.
What do they charge you with?
Shooting at an inanimate object?

jrjonesy
09-23-2008, 07:07 PM
I saw the same set up off bear creek main last year but without the moose. Slammed on the brakes but it was close enough to the road to tell that it was a big 3 point without using binocs. Noticed about 3 seconds later that it wasn't moving. I thought it was great to see. There's absolutely no mistaking that deer for a 4 point so if someone shoots it...they're rightfully 'gonna have some esplaining to do'.

fin241
09-23-2008, 07:10 PM
Good job Nimrod...glad you made the right decision.

mark4
09-23-2008, 07:16 PM
They do that here in the east koots too. I haven't seen it myself yet but I have heard about it a lot- big whitetails just inside the timber- big elk- Any red blooded hunter on the planet would take a second look- whether to shoot or not- that IS the catch. Seems a little like entrapement to me. I'm sure the high and mighty types endorse this crap all the way.

Jelvis
09-23-2008, 07:24 PM
If you view the dummy animal with your rifle scope and not with bino's they will give you a talking to. Happened to a friend he walked up to it so close he could see the stitching in the hide then and then it lit up like Christmas tree lights with sireen blaring and told not to look through rifle scopes at dummy animal, in this case a moose up Monte Lake. Jelly- don't look at dummy with rifle scope.

Jimbo
09-23-2008, 08:05 PM
Nimrod, I'm a little confused here. Was it a moose or a deer or was there one of each ? Was it an immy, or 4 pt area or were they waiting to see if you shot across the road ?
It's a good story, I could just use a few more details.

Sitkaspruce
09-23-2008, 08:15 PM
then a green truck pulls forward from a T intersection and gives us the thumbs up.
after that, feeling kind of violated we fked off . anyway, the whole experience sucked.

Why were you feeling Violated???

It is one of the most effective ways of getting the "poachers" out there and we all know how much we hate poachers.


They do that here in the east koots too. I haven't seen it myself yet but I have heard about it a lot- big whitetails just inside the timber- big elk- Any red blooded hunter on the planet would take a second look- whether to shoot or not- that IS the catch. Seems a little like entrapement to me. I'm sure the high and mighty types endorse this crap all the way.

I endore this method and I do not believe I am high and mighty, just a law abiding hunter. If you do not do anything wrong, then whats the worry??? And why would you call it entrapment??? If you shoot it and it is illegal to do so, then you are a poacher, plain and simple. Nobody made you shoot.

Cheers

SS

Nimrod
09-23-2008, 08:22 PM
" it's a set up< thier not real, look they haven't moved"
stuffed moose , stuffed deer.
the moose was well done actually, taxi did a good job. the deer was not so well done.

"Why were you feeling Violated???"
Good question,getting the adrenalin up like that is Kind of like when some one scared the crap out of you just for amusment, kind of pisses a guy off.
No question this practise is effective, anyone that gets nailed has it coming...

BigfishCanada
09-23-2008, 08:26 PM
Where is Bear Creek by the way, I would love to see more of these, Ive seen guys shoot then count the points and it really piss's me off

Slime green cat
09-23-2008, 08:33 PM
Yeah, two friends of mine were up there Sat and had to do a double take on those two decoys :lol:

They were glassing them for a while even after they realized what they were ... eventually they hear a megaphone saying "please leave the area gentlemen"

I heard they had the moose in the same area last year, and it was just under 400 meters as a crow flies from the highway and they nabbed alot of guys :redface:

Slime green cat
09-23-2008, 08:34 PM
Where is Bear Creek by the way, I would love to see more of these, Ive seen guys shoot then count the points and it really piss's me off

At the top of the OK connector just off the Sunset rd exit .

phearless
09-23-2008, 08:35 PM
I can understand the call for using your scope to check it out.
Defineately a no no.
But playing devils advocate here, is it illegal to shoot a decoy?
I know a lot of duck hunters who are going to have to be careful. Can you imagine coming out of the marsh and Whamo! Decoy spot check.
On the last magnum drake, there it is, a single pellet hole. One lonely piece of steel rolling around inside your decoy.............
or worse, your Blue heron confidence decoy has been sprayed.Oh No!

Instant ticket?
Confiscate firearms and truck/boat?
Where will it end?

mark4
09-23-2008, 08:41 PM
Yes I knew that one would be coming any second - If you lived in a place absolutely teaming with wildlife- and most of the area was country roads with small little one gas station towns here and there you would see why it stinks- and why the hunters looking through their scopes at stuffed heads aren't poachers. Every hunter likes the thought of a big buck ten minutes outside of city limits- when they set up heads just inside the actual boundary they are sure to snare some excited hunters thinking they might be outside of city limits and getting a crack at the animal they have been chasing for several months. You call them poachers plain and simple- I guess your view of what a poacher is - is way different than my definition but anyway-You think it's great- I think it stinks- It's not a moral issue as much as it is a money issue- ad up all the fines at the end of the year and tell me that it isn't about money. Ofcourse there are some places that if a guy shot at the head he would be a serious village idiot- I can't deny that- but there are situations where just about anyone would be tempted to shoot- these areas are a goldmine for the province. Much like radar traps- how do you like it when you get a speeding ticket- is speeding a moral issue or a money issue ???

Sitkaspruce
09-23-2008, 08:55 PM
Yes I knew that one would be coming any second - If you lived in a place absolutely teaming with wildlife- and most of the area was country roads with small little one gas station towns here and there you would see why it stinks- and why the hunters looking through their scopes at stuffed heads aren't poachers. Every hunter likes the thought of a big buck ten minutes outside of city limits- when they set up heads just inside the actual boundary they are sure to snare some excited hunters thinking they might be outside of city limits and getting a crack at the animal they have been chasing for several months. You think it's great- I think it stinks- It's not a moral issue as much as it is a money issue- ad up all the fines at the end of the year and tell me that it isn't about money. Ofcourse there are some places that if a guy shot at the head he would be a serious village idiot- I can't deny that- but there are situations where just about anyone would be tempted to shoot- these areas are a goldmine for the province. Much like radar traps- how do you like it when you get a speeding ticket- is speeding a moral issue or a money issue ???

I guess that when I teach CORE and tell the students to make sure of their target before shooting, never use a scope to look at a target until ready to shoot, to ensure that their background is clear and if in doubt, do not shoot at all, is just for me to hear my own voice and for them to ignore it.

As for the money thing, you sound like YOU just got pinched and now you have an axe to grind against the CO service. How much did you donate for the "Money Grab":-o:-P? I believe that if you breaks the law, you pays the fine. Pretty simple to me. And yes I have been caught speeding and paid my penalties, but now that I do fire/rescue and see what speeding can cause, I slow down. Same as I have seen what greed, trophy antlers and bragging rights have done to people. Some people will do anything to grab the headlines, even poach an animal:eek:

SS

mark4
09-23-2008, 09:11 PM
You definitely are high and mighty and now I see why you are offended- you are an HBC saint. Let me guess - you can do no wrong- you know it all- you beleive the province is always right- I do have a hell of an axe to grind and beleive me it's gonna get ground. How would you like it if you shot a ram- it passed inspection by an inspector hired by your beloved province and then the HBC saints phone it in and demanded a re-inspection ??? Then the ram appears later on the wall of some guy with big money. If you call me a poacher - I'll see you in court.

bigwhiteys
09-23-2008, 09:29 PM
I do have a hell of an axe to grind and beleive me it's gonna get ground. How would you like it if you shot a ram- it passed inspection by an inspector hired by your beloved province and then the HBC saints phone it in and demanded a re-inspection ??? Then the ram appears later on the wall of some guy with big money. If you call me a poacher - I'll see you in court.

Now that you've mentioned it... What happened with your Ram?

Carl

Gateholio
09-23-2008, 09:33 PM
I sorta think of the decoys as bait cars...

I think they should be used with great discretion. In my opinion, it's better to nail ONE guy that KNOWS what he is doing is clearly illegal, than nab a dozen guys that are a little confused about exact regulations regarding shooitng areas/no shooting, etc..

mbhjls79
09-23-2008, 09:43 PM
I know a few years ago they found a bunch of dead moose taken up on bear lake and sunset main road. Someone was shooting them and not taking any of the meat? Maybe they died to close to the road, because those two roads get alot of traffic. I think what ever they can do to stop hunters from breaking the law, I am all for it.

mark4
09-23-2008, 09:44 PM
I've got nothing to say to you big whitey's- why don't you become a cop or something ??? Hammer the resident hunters of bc.

Gun Dog
09-23-2008, 10:07 PM
mark4 has a valid point. There's flaunting the law -- i.e. pitlamping -- and there's technical fouls. How many people here know where the MU boundary is when it follows a river? Is it the left bank, right bank or down the middle?

Fisher-Dude
09-23-2008, 10:08 PM
Why were you feeling Violated???

It is one of the most effective ways of getting the "poachers" out there and we all know how much we hate poachers.



I endore this method and I do not believe I am high and mighty, just a law abiding hunter. If you do not do anything wrong, then whats the worry??? And why would you call it entrapment??? If you shoot it and it is illegal to do so, then you are a poacher, plain and simple. Nobody made you shoot.

Cheers

SS

Agree 100% SS. The CO Service is BC is very thinly stretched. Each officer in BC is responsible for over 8000 square km, which is twice as much as Alberta, the next least-covered province at 4400 km2 per officer. The only way to get the message across to wannabe "hunters" who shoot and count later is to be there when they are committing the offence. The decoys are the practical way of doing it. Investigating a three day old rotting moose carcass is a tough way to get a conviction, or even a lead on who did the poaching.

Play by the rules. If in doubt AT ALL, don't shoot. I applaud the COs for catching these thieving ba$tards who feel that shooting an animal and leaving it for the coyotes, or sneaking it home at midnight, is no big deal. Maybe we would be able to support more hunting opportunities for law-abiding, ethical hunters if there were fewer dickheads poaching our game and taking meat off our families' tables.

bigwhiteys
09-23-2008, 10:12 PM
I've got nothing to say to you big whitey's- why don't you become a cop or something ??? Hammer the resident hunters of bc

Nah... They don't pay enough.

Carl

beeker
09-23-2008, 10:26 PM
I think these "sting" operations are a great way to catch poachers.

Last year I experienced one where there was a massive 4x4 muley 2 days after the season was closed. Needless to say my partner and i left there feeling pretty satisfied that we acted responsibly and were commended by the CO.

I don't feel sorry for anyone that shoots at game that is clearly illegal...There is no way of overlooking the golden rule "always be 100% before you pull the trigger."

mark4
09-24-2008, 06:40 AM
And as they held hands and walked together- the HBC saints softly sang their mantra..... We can do no wrong....we know it all......and the province is always right.........

BiG Boar
09-24-2008, 07:13 AM
My personal opinion is that this kind of stuff is fine. They are probably setting them up in no shooting zones. ie. within 400 meters of a highway or within illegal shooting distance of a road. When it is illegal to shoot in a situation like this, or when someone gets out of thier vehicle with a loaded gun, or when someone doesnt have the propper tags, or even a licence, I dont want someone that isnt playing by the rules hunting the same turf as me. As far as I see it, they are competition and taking my game.

The Hermit
09-24-2008, 07:29 AM
Think if I offered to carry the dummies out and set them up my halo would fit a little tighter? LOL I hate photo radar and was the happiest guy in BC when they canned that deal but I am all for putting FAIR methods in the hands of the CO to catch poachers. Seems to me that they are only really going after "roadhunters" with this method! LOL

Remington
09-24-2008, 07:37 AM
OR they could change the 4 point season into a 3 point season. But that would just make to much sense for BC to do.:???:

Sitkaspruce
09-24-2008, 08:07 AM
You definitely are high and mighty and now I see why you are offended- you are an HBC saint. Let me guess - you can do no wrong- you know it all- you beleive the province is always right- I do have a hell of an axe to grind and beleive me it's gonna get ground. How would you like it if you shot a ram- it passed inspection by an inspector hired by your beloved province and then the HBC saints phone it in and demanded a re-inspection ??? Then the ram appears later on the wall of some guy with big money. If you call me a poacher - I'll see you in court.

I find it funny thay you think just because I do not like poachers that I am high and mighty....and a saint I am not....at least to my wife I'm not:razz:.

LMAO, the HBS Saints.....sounds like a good hockey team. I cannot wait for you to name that team:tongue::mrgreen:

As with your Ram, I take it that it has been seized and you are now in big crap.......at least you are acting that way. This will be a pretty big axe to grind, good luck. One thing I do not understand is if you made a mistake, own up to it, learn by it and move on. Getting all pi$$y will not get you anywhere, but if it makes you feel good, have a go at it......

And with respect to the Decoys, just remember, if in doubt, do not shoot.:razz::smile:, a good moto to live by, dontcha think?????

Cheers

SS

mainland hunter
09-24-2008, 08:09 AM
Mark4 I can understand your bitterness as in your situation it seemed like a legitimate mistake and I dont think anyone thought of you as a poacher, at least I didnt. However shooting a 3 pt buck in a 4 pt season is different. If it's clearly a 3 pt set-up and a guy shoots it, He is disregarding the regs and should be caught.

budismyhorse
09-24-2008, 08:12 AM
Think if I offered to carry the dummies out and set them up my halo would fit a little tighter? LOL I hate photo radar and was the happiest guy in BC when they canned that deal but I am all for putting FAIR methods in the hands of the CO to catch poachers. Seems to me that they are only really going after "roadhunters" with this method! LOL

good point!

The main focus of these stings is to nail the people that are not hunting safely. Shooting out of vehicles, from numbered highways, off the hood, ect. That is the main objective - Safety.

and boy do they nail em! In the koots, my friend put a pill into the big elk by Horseshoe legally, afterwards the CO's told him he was the 3rd person that morning to do it safely out of 25 trucks! All other trucks received fines. That is a horrible statistic and something the ANTI's would love to get ahold of and throw in our faces. Don't think for a minute Anti-hunting groups won't use any means to shut things down.

Unsafe hunters are bad for our sport and its future.

willy442
09-24-2008, 09:24 AM
And as they held hands and walked together- the HBC saints softly sang their mantra..... We can do no wrong....we know it all......and the province is always right.........

Mark4;
Corb the fact that you are coming forward now with so much bitterness, tells me that you ignored the advice given to you by some here that are not high and mighty, but rather a little more in tune with Sheep Hunting than you are. The results of your Rams confinscation could have been minimized had you listened to those around you asking that you do the right thing. The option was yours when you pulled the trigger and it was also yours on submitting it for reinspection. Now I'm sorry to say you are getting what you deserve, you let it go on past the honest mistake stage.
To blame others tells me and those from the ministry watching, that you have learned nothing.:sad:

CSG
09-24-2008, 10:52 AM
what exactly is the law about shooting from the hood of your truck??

kbb
09-24-2008, 11:04 AM
someone shot a 3point moose up there on the weekend and left :(
I personally don't think is enough of them co's up there right now. For example I saw two trucks up there last night between 8-8.30 pm road hunting with spot lights. I have their lience plate #
Real sad, give the rest of us a bad name

Tyler660
09-24-2008, 11:11 AM
They have one setup in region 4 around the elk river. Its a monster Elk in a field just off the paved road and have been nailing guys everyday according to my buddy that lives up there.

2slow
09-24-2008, 11:12 AM
what exactly is the law about shooting from the hood of your truck??
I believe the regs say that you are not allowed to have a loaded firearm in or on a motorized vehicle. The on part I can understand if your riding an atv or motorcycle but when it extends to using your truck hood for a rest I think that is wrong but I dont make the laws.

ultramafic
09-24-2008, 11:13 AM
what exactly is the law about shooting from the hood of your truck??


If I am not misinterpreting the regulations you cannot use any part of the vehicle for a rest to shoot from while hunting.

Mike

ultramafic
09-24-2008, 11:20 AM
but when it extends to using your truck hood for a rest I think that is wrong but I dont make the laws.


I have mixed feelings about this in one way it would allow you to possibly take a more accurate shot leading to a quicker and less suffering death for the animal.

In the other way I could see how it might be more dangerous if you were say hunting with a buddy and he jumps out the other side of the vehicle potentially right in the line of fire... ( probably unlikely but a lot of rules/laws appear to be created to lessen the stupid factor )

as far as which is right who knows but the rules appear to say no no no...

Mike

krazy
09-24-2008, 11:23 AM
If you view the dummy animal with your rifle scope and not with bino's they will give you a talking to.

oh no, not a talking to! :eek:

Mr. Dean
09-24-2008, 11:30 AM
And as they held hands and walked together- the HBC saints softly sang their mantra..... We can do no wrong....we know it all......and the province is always right.........

I was away when this happened and missed the thread. mainlandhunter filled me in.

he stated that the animal was taken and that it WAS verified - Then a picture was posted. THEN under the scutiny of members, it came to light that maybe it wasn't a legal critter.

That's about all I know. I'd encourage you to start another thread on the happenings of the animal. I think it would be benificial as a learning tool for others.

Clearly IF there were reprocussions, it was a mistake and shit does happen. BUT, we should learn from them, grow, and move on...... So dude, how about sharing a little?

Was this animal a "mistake" and what was the verifiers rationale of it not being one; was his judgement a mistake also????

....If so, talk about a BAD day!

Gateholio
09-24-2008, 11:30 AM
Using the hood of your truck is technically illegal. Although it provides for a decent rest, as long as you are sure your buddy isn't on the wrong side of the hood, and that your muzzle isn't pointed down to the hood.:p

Learning to use shooting sticks or a shooting staff is probbaly a better option.

308Lover
09-24-2008, 11:31 AM
I sweated blood on Sunday watching a young bull moose (with binocs) WAITING AND WAITING FOR HIM TO TURN HIS HEAD! He was a three by three---what a letdown. BUT--I'm afraid he will get shot by someone else. I'm all for the decoys. They don't punish the ethical hunters. (Remember the RCMP guy caught at night near Hope in a deer sting?) I remember it well.

Wild_Dog
09-24-2008, 12:20 PM
I have mixed feelings about this in one way it would allow you to possibly take a more accurate shot leading to a quicker and less suffering death for the animal.

In the other way I could see how it might be more dangerous if you were say hunting with a buddy and he jumps out the other side of the vehicle potentially right in the line of fire... ( probably unlikely but a lot of rules/laws appear to be created to lessen the stupid factor )

as far as which is right who knows but the rules appear to say no no no...

Mike


Not so stupid really.....hunting with a buddy about four years ago and exactly that happened.....we were leaving the area at around noon and on the truck ride out saw a nice buck on my side (I was driving) Jumped out grapped the gun then remembered my buddy....looked over just as he was bringing his rifle over the hood of the truck. Needless to say I hit the ground fast.

People do stupid things in the heat of the moment sometimes!

threedhunter
09-24-2008, 12:37 PM
the regs say that we can not shoot across ANY road surface, answer your quiry about the hood?hood on truck on road.............

Buck_virgin
09-24-2008, 02:47 PM
There is actually a lot of work goes into setting up these stings. There many qualifiers that the officers have to meet before they are given permission. They are resposibile for any round that is discharged at that target no matter where it goes. The way they can charge you with wildlife violations is because the fakes are made from real hides so it can be classified as a real animal as opposed to shooting at a target that looked like an animal. It is actually quite the operation to witness or be a part of especially for pit lampers. It is very effective but is very very dangerous because everyone is guaranteed to be armed and surprised. You can't use any part of your vehicle as a rest for shooting whether you are in or out of the vehicle. You can feel violated or you can thank the CO's for doing their jobs well. Many of the CO's can't do these operations because of budget and time constraints. They will never catch a responsible hunter in these traps. It is like the hooker stings...the animal being the hooker...If you are single guy out looking for a perspective date and on your way to the bar you see the hooker and think well it is almost legal so i'll take it...BANG you are busted...so is it really entrapment...If you are poaching you are poaching in that case there is no way around it if you go bang you are guilty.

Stone Sheep Steve
09-24-2008, 03:07 PM
I was in the taxi sho a year or two ago and the CO decoy was there needing a new cape. It was shot up pretty good:-?.

Pretty sad.

SSS

bighornbob
09-24-2008, 03:15 PM
Using the hood of your truck is technically illegal. Although it provides for a decent rest, as long as you are sure your buddy isn't on the wrong side of the hood, and that your muzzle isn't pointed down to the hood.:p


I talked to the head CO for the southern Interior about the question about shooting from the hood of the truck. He said he has never seen anyone charged for using the hood or door for a rest when shooting into a clearcut from a legal road. He said people that usually get charged with it are also doing something else like shhoting from a paved road or in a no shooting area.

But like anything with the CO's I think it would depend on the CO stopping you.

BHB

300WM
09-24-2008, 03:21 PM
the regs say that we can not shoot across ANY road surface, answer your quiry about the hood?hood on truck on road.............


Are you sure about ANY road surface? Where does it say this in the regs?

Gateholio
09-24-2008, 03:21 PM
I talked to the head CO for the southern Interior about the question about shooting from the hood of the truck. He said he has never seen anyone charged for using the hood or door for a rest when shooting into a clearcut from a legal road. He said people that usually get charged with it are also doing something else like shhoting from a paved road or in a no shooting area.

But like anything with the CO's I think it would depend on the CO stopping you.

BHB

I agree, and that it's mostly up to the circumstances.

I once saw a guy jump out of his truck, stick his rifle through the open window of the truck, using the door as a rest, and shoot.

I didn't think much of it, as he was shooting safely, and especially when I realized the guy only had one arm, and the other was artificial.

knighthunter
09-24-2008, 03:52 PM
They have the dummy's here in Mb also. We don't have the point system here, so what they get charged with are: shooting off a road or shooting out of a vehicle or night hunting, shooting on private property without permission. the dummy animals they use here can move. Such as move the head, lift a leg.

ultramafic
09-24-2008, 04:00 PM
Not so stupid really.....hunting with a buddy about four years ago and exactly that happened.....we were leaving the area at around noon and on the truck ride out saw a nice buck on my side (I was driving) Jumped out grapped the gun then remembered my buddy....looked over just as he was bringing his rifle over the hood of the truck. Needless to say I hit the ground fast.

People do stupid things in the heat of the moment sometimes!


Yes very true perhaps stupid may have been a wrong choice of words... ( always get the dirty look from my wife when our 2 yr old says that word :roll:) what you described was more of what I meant...

By no means did I mean any offence to anyone just pointing out that many laws and regluations appear to be designed for those who are in the heat of the moment or are not thinking at the time of their actions...

Mike

Dad and son
09-24-2008, 05:02 PM
Also remember it is technically illegal to lean a loaded firearm against a vehicle. For example you are out walking with the magazine in your rifle. You get back to your quad or truck and lean your rifle against it while you get ready to drive away. You need to take the magazine out before leaning it agains the vehicle.

1899
09-24-2008, 05:09 PM
Here is an interesting case on point, and it includes an analysis of entrapment:
http://www.canlii.org/en/bc/bcpc/doc/2002/2002bcpc19/2002bcpc19.html

wildman 22
09-24-2008, 05:51 PM
bud is my horse ,did you say your friend shot at an elk target that was legal? that would piss me off if they did something like that. do you get to keep the decoy. i think i would cut my tag and take it with me.

Jimbo
09-24-2008, 05:52 PM
Good job 1899 !! Nothing beats than reading that kind of judgement directly if a guy wants to be well informed. Thanks for posting it for us.

Edward Teach
09-24-2008, 05:59 PM
the regs say that we can not shoot across ANY road surface, answer your quiry about the hood?hood on truck on road.............

So drive into the ditch first!

kgs
09-24-2008, 06:19 PM
I personally believe that these stings are necessary to help catch poachers. I have had no problems dealing with CO's. A couple of years ago I made a mistake and shot a cow moose. I was pretty upset with myself as I could not believe I had done something so stupid.. It was a combination of inexperience and buck fever and forgetting the the golden rule to not shoot if you are not sure. I gutted the moose and then called the CO's. They advised me to bring it in to them which I did. The first thing the CO did was shake my hand and thank me for doing the right thing he then asked for my hunting license and was very pleased that I had cut my tag for moose. He explained to me that a lot of so called hunters do not turn themselves in. The meat was given to the sallyann and he returned my hunting license so I could hunt my deer tag. He told me to come and see him at his office in a couple days. During my interview he asked me what happened and I told him. He told me that he and his partner would discuss the issue and get back to me. I had told him at one point during the interview that no matter what happens I take full responsibility for my actions and will accept whatever decision they come up with. To my pleasant surprise they decided give me a warning and told me that if I made another mistake I would not get off so lightly. The fact was they listen to my explanation and came to the belief that I was telling the truth. My point is be honest and accept responsbility for your actions and you will be a better person and hunter for it.

1899
09-24-2008, 06:38 PM
Good on you KGS! Thanks for sharing that story.

jwe63
09-24-2008, 07:37 PM
I had my very first moose sighting while moose hunting on the weekend. (This is my second year hunting moose, but have hunted deer for years)
I strained with the binocs for minutes trying to count points, as my conscience screamed "You'd better be sure dummass"

Man, I feel the pain. The moose walked off as I was straining to count......:frown:

BCfishguy
09-24-2008, 08:11 PM
KGS, well done. I wish more "hunters" would take ownership of their actions (and mistakes) and do the right thing morally/ethically. Sure, there are enforcement officers that might want to press the issue, but most are quite reasonable to an honest hunter. You are the kind of hunter I want to be associated with and known as.

swampdonkey
09-24-2008, 10:07 PM
I Would Like To See More Of Them Every Year For The Past 4-6 We Have Found Dead 3x3s 4x3s In The Dardnells Lake Palmer Meadows Area The Cos Come Out But There Is Not Much They Can Do It Makes Me Sick To See All That Meat Go To Waste Like Most Of You Are Saying Be Sure Before You Pull The Trigger

hotload
09-24-2008, 11:13 PM
Read the Kelowna local rags tonight and it will fill you in as to why these stings are in affect. Since opening day already 2 moose left to rot because somebody might have thought they were 2 tines and shot, looked and ran. Couple of deer shot and left as well, probably thought they were Whities. Mistake? or Poached?. They made themselves poachers when they shot, looked and ran. Actually as I remember one of the moose had some of the meat trimmed away and extracted of it's antlers. No rocket science needed here.

2 thumbs up, way up,for C.O.'s and their decoys.

guest
09-24-2008, 11:35 PM
I too have no problem with C/O's doing this.
If your shooting at something illegal, you deserve to be caught and charged. This at least cleans up some of the ( Jack ___'s ) ou there.
C/T

You C/O's .... keep it going, matter fact expand the operation ..... set up better though so not so many discover it's not the real thing. The middle of the road thing, or wide open side hill does'nt get enough of them.

Just one guys opinion.

Gateholio
09-24-2008, 11:49 PM
There is actually a lot of work goes into setting up these stings. There many qualifiers that the officers have to meet before they are given permission. They are resposibile for any round that is discharged at that target no matter where it goes. The way they can charge you with wildlife violations is because the fakes are made from real hides so it can be classified as a real animal as opposed to shooting at a target that looked like an animal. It is actually quite the operation to witness or be a part of especially for pit lampers. It is very effective but is very very dangerous because everyone is guaranteed to be armed and surprised. You can't use any part of your vehicle as a rest for shooting whether you are in or out of the vehicle. y.


That is good to hear, and adresses the comment I made about being diligent when using these decoys.

There has been a decoy near us that has been used a few times, and shot at a few times. It's pretty clear it is on private land- Anyone shooting at it KNOWS what they are doing.

Little Hawk
09-25-2008, 06:44 AM
Howdy,

This is an important thread for all hunters to read. Some good points made here.

I believe the bush is safer now - thanks to hunter training programs - than it was 30 or more years ago. But there are still idiots out there who - by their sheer stupidity or blatant disregard for the LAW - endanger this great privilege and pastime that we all cherish.

It is these IDIOTS - shooting at decoys, poaching, not knowing what's behind the target, shooting first then verifying after - who provide the ammunition for the anti-hunter's to use against us. And believe me, the thread that our blessed hunting activity hangs from - is tenuous at best.
The winds of political-will can change things overnight.

We all make mistakes. What matters is what we learn from them and what we can pass on to the next generation of hunters. If I screw-up - and I do - I will fess-up to it and hopefully be better off for it, and someone else won't be slighted by something I've done.

As far as the CO Service in BC goes, as has been mentioned already, these boy's are stretched so thin as to be nearly irrelevant. So I heartily endorse any and all ideas that help weed-out those who make the bush unsafe and provide more fuel for those story-hungry asshole news reporters who want nothing better than an opportunity to slam us hunters.

Four years ago; East Kootenays near Canal Flats.

Buddy drops a nice 3-pt Whitey. He cuts his tag then guts it, lops the rack along with his balls.
Days later we head over near Creston and climb into the West slope of the Pucell's above Kootenay Lk (Sanka Cr) to look for other Buddie's LEH cow Elk. Had it all planned to a "T". All on the up-and-up. For the next two days we see nothing but chipmunks and ravens so we bust camp and head down the mountain. While driving out we meet Mr. CO driving in. He turns on his 'This is a bust!' flashing lights to make it official.
He's very calm and polite. Checks all our licences then notices that buddy forgot to nick the 'Region' portion of his tag. He then asks to see the carcass. We show him the rack and the quarters (in cheese cloth) and he asks, "Where's the nuts?" I was feeling a little silly at this point as I was also there when buddy gutted the animal and I, too, totally forgot about the 'nut-thing'.

The CO got to the point. He says, "Well, you've got two infractions here, I can easily nail you $125.00 for each of them." But, he knew from the time he spent with us what sort of hunters/people we were - we were 100% cooperative as he tried to do his job - that it was an honest mistake. He fined Buddy $125-bucks so we would learn from it. And we did. Then I asked him if he could tell us where to find other Buddie's LEH cow. He asked to see the Authorization and as he read it he raised his eyebrows and said, "Well, damn good thing you boys didn't shoot a cow up here or it would be in the back of my truck right now... you're hunting in the WRONG area." He then got out his map of the Creston Valley area and spent considerable time showing us where to hunt down in the valley. He was so helpful with us; way beyond the call of duty.

Most of us need a 'wake-up call' every now and then. People that carelessly litter, or that are downright dangerous and disrespectful of the LAW when in the bush - should be STOMPED!

budismyhorse
09-25-2008, 07:13 AM
bud is my horse ,did you say your friend shot at an elk target that was legal? that would piss me off if they did something like that. do you get to keep the decoy. i think i would cut my tag and take it with me.


wildman,
my friend is a straight and narrow ethical hunter, he slammed on the brakes because of the sheer size of the dummy elk, glassed it, watched it turn its head from side to side (it was a robo elk), crept up a hill out of view until he was in a legal shooting area, and shot the elk (twice). He was pretty jacked up and didn't really notice it was a dummy until he saw the lights and CO trucks coming.

He said the CO's congratulated him and he felt like an idiot but was glad he didn't accidently do something wrong.

wildman 22
09-25-2008, 05:12 PM
budismyhorse, i didn' say you did anything wrong.i was just thinking if you had your son or a new hunter and you did everything right,stalked and shot a legal (robotic)elk some young or newbee hunters could be turned off from hunting. i think it is a waste of time to put legal sized decoys at times of day when your legally allowed to shoot them.how much time did you waste stalking +2 bullets.it just doesn't seem right to me.

bad arrow
09-25-2008, 08:39 PM
well, as far as I know, it ain't illegal to look at game through your scope, and after 30+ years of hunting I dont even own bino's, had a pair once but find the optics of my scope work just fine for counting points. Oh I almost forgot, I never observe people through my scope, what for? If its illegal to observe game through a scope then thats taking it too far, I think.

budismyhorse
09-26-2008, 07:15 AM
budismyhorse, i didn' say you did anything wrong.i was just thinking if you had your son or a new hunter and you did everything right,stalked and shot a legal (robotic)elk some young or newbee hunters could be turned off from hunting. i think it is a waste of time to put legal sized decoys at times of day when your legally allowed to shoot them.how much time did you waste stalking +2 bullets.it just doesn't seem right to me.

yeah no problem! I didn't take any offence to what you were saying, just parlaying my buddies story for clarity.

cheers!

however I don't agree with you about it being a waste of time. They bust plenty of crap hunters doing this. Examples are guys with no tags or liscence, shooting out of vehicles, shooting in poor light........some of them are drunk and the RCMP get involved. Get these dudes off the road is what I say.

and if "knowing" these kinds of sting ops are out there, it may deter crap hunters from doing such things.

The worst one I heard from the CO was he busted a guy who shot out of his truck, had no tags, didn't own a license and...........had his young son in the passenger seat. Now what kind of chance does this little kid have to be an ethical hunter later on? He'll be getting a 2 million candle power flashlight for his 14th birthday!

Not sure how a young or newbie hunter could be turned off from hunting if they shot at the dummy doing everything legally??? If they did something wrong and were then charged...of course they may be turned off then.....but I fail to see the logic? Do you think young or new hunters should be given a "grace period" where they are allowed to break laws and hunt unsafely?

Stone Sheep Steve
09-26-2008, 10:03 AM
well, as far as I know, it ain't illegal to look at game through your scope, and after 30+ years of hunting I dont even own bino's, had a pair once but find the optics of my scope work just fine for counting points. Oh I almost forgot, I never observe people through my scope, what for? If its illegal to observe game through a scope then thats taking it too far, I think.

So what do you do if you see movement at a distance in the thick stuff but can't positively identify the object?? :?:

SSS

wildman 22
09-26-2008, 08:05 PM
Bud Is My Horse Points Well Taken ,but I Think Most Of The People You Had Stated In Your Last Post Would Have Shot At An Illegal Animal Also.and The Father And Son Without A License Do You Consider Them Hunters?i Dont.and To Bring Things In To Perspective If I Brought My Son To The P.n.e. And He Popped A Balloon With A Dart Or A Pellet Gun And The Guy Said That Wasn't A Real Balloon ,you Dont Get A Prize ,i Think He Would Be Turned Off From Doing That Again.

Gateholio
09-26-2008, 08:40 PM
Bud Is My Horse Points Well Taken ,but I Think Most Of The People You Had Stated In Your Last Post Would Have Shot At An Illegal Animal Also.and The Father And Son Without A License Do You Consider Them Hunters?i Dont.and To Bring Things In To Perspective If I Brought My Son To The P.n.e. And He Popped A Balloon With A Dart Or A Pellet Gun And The Guy Said That Wasn't A Real Balloon ,you Dont Get A Prize ,i Think He Would Be Turned Off From Doing That Again.

Turn off the CAP'S LOCK!!

wildman 22
09-26-2008, 10:22 PM
sorry gatehouse will you survive?

todbartell
09-26-2008, 11:08 PM
sorry gatehouse will you survive?

I am sure he will survive, he was just trying to stop you looking like a complete fool on the internet

gitnadoix
09-26-2008, 11:30 PM
The way I see it:

Every new young hunter that observes a sting operation in person probably tells every one of their friends and those kids in turn tell their friends, etc etc.......seems like a pretty good cost for return value to me.

As for the folks who seem to think this is some sort of entrapment or enticement into crime or some such shinola, I guess GM and Ford etc should stop putting cars on display in their lots I mean their just teasing people into stealing them.....get yer heads back out in the sunshine I guarantee the air will smell better and your view and over all outlook on life will improve.

4pntsorbetter
09-27-2008, 12:52 PM
Bear Creek is just outside Kelowna going towards Westbank on the right. And it may not be entrapment but I'm sure it must be fun for the CO's who get to sit there and watch everybody hammer the brakes and get all excited, and then confused. Probably a lot of poaching in that area due to the close proximity to town, more of them they catch the better!

Gateholio
09-27-2008, 01:21 PM
I am sure he will survive, he was just trying to stop you looking like a complete fool on the internet

HA HA

:razz::p

wildman 22
09-27-2008, 09:10 PM
hey gatehouse and bartell, having caps lock on ,is it really that destracting.sorry but i didn't notice it.how old are you guys anyway?when i first started writing, it was on slate.give us old guys a break.

Gateholio
09-27-2008, 11:08 PM
hey gatehouse and bartell, having caps lock on ,is it really that destracting.sorry but i didn't notice it.how old are you guys anyway?when i first started writing, it was on slate.give us old guys a break.

Don't worry about it, we are just hacking on you a bit.:razz:

As you can see, the software turns your CAPS LOCK post into Capitalizing the first letter of each word. Annoying to read. And All caps is considered "shouting" on the intraweb.

chola
09-27-2008, 11:10 PM
hey gatehouse and bartell, having caps lock on ,is it really that destracting.sorry but i didn't notice it.how old are you guys anyway?when i first started writing, it was on slate.give us old guys a break.

;-) They will....LOL...just be patient

mark
09-28-2008, 10:19 AM
I always thought it would be a blast to set up a "legal" moose decoy a couple hundred yards out in a cut on a busy logging rd. Hide in the bushes with a camcorder and watch guys blast all their ammo at it! :D

Sitkaspruce
09-28-2008, 01:14 PM
I always thought it would be a blast to set up a "legal" moose decoy a couple hundred yards out in a cut on a busy logging rd. Hide in the bushes with a camcorder and watch guys blast all their ammo at it! :D

We once skinned a moose and layed it over a log about 200 yards out. Then placed the antlers on the end....and put a brown derby between the antlers:-P.

Two days later we went back and the hide had 7 more holes in it, the derby was missing:?:, but the antlers were still there. I wish I had time to set up a camera for that on. Not sure if we made any friends those two days, but some people must have had a laugh.......

Cheers

SS

NightOwl74
09-28-2008, 01:38 PM
Getting sick and tired of the idiots around the Kelowna area. Every year it just gets worse. As soon as you leave pavement in this area you will get the feeling you are entering a scene from "Deliverence". For example, yesterday I took my dad fishing at Spring Lake in the hills above Peachland. There were 8 other boats on this tiny lake and there were a couple of goofs in an aluminum shooting a pellet gun at their empty beer cans floating in the water. Now there are aluminum cans on the bottom of this beautiful little lake. It discusted a few guys so they left. The fat slob with they pellet pistol ruined it for everyone out there. Are these guys raised by rednecks? You bet. Hey Kelowna area sportsman, smarten up! I grew up here and I'm gettin sick of this sh@*!

4pntsorbetter
10-02-2008, 10:04 AM
If your sick of it, like most of us are, then when you see somebody doing something stupid go up to them and make them feel stupid. Embarass the crap out of them. Hopefully they will either learn, or at least do thier stupid sh$# somewhere else. With the easy of access to wilderness areas these days every yokle with a truck and a gun is in the woods trying to be a hunter or fisherman, and just like your first round of golf you need somebody to tell you not to walk across the green in front of everybodys ball, or to keep the cart off the green or whatever. No everybody has the good sense god gave a goat. Until somebody learns em right!

wildman 22
10-02-2008, 06:19 PM
We once skinned a moose and layed it over a log about 200 yards out. Then placed the antlers on the end....and put a brown derby between the antlers:-P.

Two days later we went back and the hide had 7 more holes in it, the derby was missing:?:, but the antlers were still there. I wish I had time to set up a camera for that on. Not sure if we made any friends those two days, but some people must have had a laugh.......

Cheers

SS
sitka spruce,did you not need to keep the antlers for inspection? secondly,ive never ever have seen one of these decoys before,but if you are a seasoned hunter do you think you can tell that these decoys are fake at the distances that they set them up at? if so ,were you actually doing anything wrong at shooting at something you knew was fake? wildman 22

Andy83
06-09-2009, 11:28 AM
I saw the 3x3 moose decoy last year opening day of immature bull season just off sunset main. My dad was taking pictures of it after realizing what it was and as he stepped into the ditch a speakerbox said to vacate the area. Im sure it did get shot at though

kgriz
06-10-2009, 07:10 PM
Damn those nasty poachers!...Kill them all...Hey what happens when the enforcers GET enforced....does it end up in the paper or maybe a hunting magazine??? Not around here.....they simply take "early retirement".

Andy83
06-10-2009, 07:28 PM
who took an early retirement??? a co you know of??

Wolfman
06-10-2009, 07:29 PM
The more poachers who get taken down the better as far as I'm concerned.


Wolfman

Andy83
06-10-2009, 07:32 PM
I couldn't agree more wolfman

kgriz
06-10-2009, 07:54 PM
A co??!!! Gracious no, I couldn't imagine such a thing!