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View Full Version : Crossbows in archery season



Walksalot
03-15-2005, 07:53 AM
I think a person should be able to use a crossbow in the archery season. Historically they are older than dirt. The argument about the superior accuracy of a crossbow is a non issue, in my opinion, as superior accuracy translates into less wounded animals.

boxhitch
03-15-2005, 03:13 PM
Isn't a crossbow just a 'cross-over' device , between those that can't own a rifle and those that can't shoot a real bow ? :wink:

Besides the sighting differences, I don't think the crossbow has much advantage/disadvantage. It has a string, so must be archery. IMO

greybark
03-15-2005, 03:19 PM
Hey Walksalot , With all due respect i disagree with the premises of your post. Firstly being historically older dos`t quallify for anything other than being old.
The superior accuracy of the crossbow is an issue (ease of use being another). I have seen novices accurate out to 50yds and those who practice and use rangefinders accurate beyond 80yds. Sound game management centers around harvest numbers and I recall studies in Ohio that show large increases in Whitetailed deer harvests as result of use of crossbows. If a small portion of that increase were to happen in the area i hunted WT foe over 40 years the season would be shortened with new limits. I would be really pi-- off if this happened just because of the use of what my buddy (crossbow hunter) calls "the big easy'.
The "less wounded animals" thing is a non-issue. All bowhunters are encouraged shoot with-in their personnel and weapon capabilities and wounding would even out and be minimal.

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Walksalot
03-16-2005, 07:42 AM
Greybark, an archer with a compound can shoot out to fifty or sixty yards with the accuracy to harvest an animal. The problem is the estimation of the yardage to make that shot so many compound shooters have went to range finders and in a hunting situation I think this is good because this equates to less wounded animals. Personally I don't have one yet because my pesonal effective distance is thirty yards.

Archers staying within their capabilities is would be nice but I think this is a bit of a pipe dream. We all know traditional and compound shooters who have taken "Hail Mary" shots and when you think about it those archers have no reguard or respect for the animal or they wouldn't take that big of a risk to wound that animal.

I used to be dead against crossbow, in fact I used to be of the mind set that I would rather have a sister in a whore house than a brother who hunted with a crossbow but I have since softened my opinion of crossbows.

Tank
03-16-2005, 08:19 AM
hey guys, i'm really enjoying the crossbow debates!....but could someone fill me in....is a crossbow currently allowed during archery season? (i've never looked into it as i've never been remotely close to the oportunity to hunt with a crossbow).

willyqbc
03-16-2005, 08:56 AM
Well i believe that crossbows should be allowed. As I've stated in the other thread I don't believe them to be any more effective than a compound. My only concern at all with allowing the crossbow is that it makes it very easy for the slob hunters who want a quick way to get an "in" on the archery season. They figure that the crossbow is just the same as shooting their gun and so requires little or no practice. I personally know people like this.....some tried compound briefly and when they found it required some time and dedication they just picked up a X-bow and went hunting. Now i don't know about you guys, but these are not the people I want to share the woods with during archery season. Now that being said i belive that all archers need to stick together so the X-bow must be allowed, and with that we will just have to deal with the slobs and try to do enough to boost our image where they may be hurting it.

Chris

greybark
03-16-2005, 10:31 AM
Hey Walksalot , I figure only 3-5% compound bowhunters are able to harvest big game at 50-60yds. Heck any novice crossbow hunter with a rangefinder can do that. Once again it proves that the rate of harvest will increase to the point of I will have my bowseasons shortened and limits cut back. The crossbow`s effectiveness coupled with an increase of the type of hunter you describe threatens the bow seasons and present bag limits. I appreciate your views .- Greybark

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Walksalot
03-16-2005, 01:53 PM
Greybark, have you ever shot a compound or have you always been a traditional shooter? I don't practice as much as I should but on my range with my bow I can group the arrows fairly well at fifty yards and I am by no means a good shot. This is why I shoot a compound because I started from square one and learned the correct form and practiced enough to have it drilled into my subconscience. Now I can set the bow down for a month or more, pick it up and in an hour of shooting I am back in the groove. I am not prepared to make the commitment to practice required to be proficient with traditional tackle.

Crossbows are legal in British Columbia and the harvest rate in the bow season has not skyrocketed. I think the vast majority of bowhunters have a love for the sport and that is why they are out there. There will always be the bad apples in the barrel but that is a fact of life we have to live with.

I know personally a hunter in Alberta who shot traditional equipment and gave up the sport because of the animals they were wounding and not finding.

rock
03-16-2005, 02:14 PM
I been hunting for years, enjoyed many hunts with rifle as well my bow & arrow. The only thing i see wrong is people dont see there limits in situations in the bush. A rifle is a lot more forgiving in the bush then any archery equipment. Hunting with archery equipment is so much different, most shots taken with a bow should be within your shooting range, unfortunately some people push that envelope. Now with that in mind I find people should be responsible, bow & arrow you know your limits you practice, to many people I know owning a crossbow is like a rifle, my opinion is people take an advantage with that crossbow and take that extra long shot , now dont get me wrong Im sure everybody has made a mistake , but we hopefully learn through those mistakes.

greybark
03-16-2005, 02:49 PM
Hey Walksalot , I shot compounds form 1985 - 95. and traditional 1995-05. I have done very well in 3-d shoots , championships (one Cdn title) as well as 5 P+Y (3 more pending) and 10 entries in the newly being formed BRBC club.
Of course the crossbow harvest has not made an impact with the exception of Elk harvests. half the elk in the early archery season were taken by crossbow and i bet their success will snow ball the crossbow numbers along with the associated increase in harvest. Almost Wither we like it or not generally crossbows are looked down on by the archery community.(GENERALLY) When they break out of that shadow the numbers of crossbow hunters and their harvests will no doubt shorten (already short)the bow seasons and bag limits i now enjoy.

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greybark
03-16-2005, 03:09 PM
Hey Walksalot , Again with due respect I know of several rifle hunters who did poorly in regards to wounding and quit hunting.
I have always thought the better compound shots always made better traditional shots because of the reason of form and mental disapline being pounded in as you say over and over . I enjoyed my rifle hunting , then enjoyed my compound bowhunting and now enjoy traditional bowhunting. With the increasing number of crossbow hunters and the increase of harvest I feel threatened by as Willyqbc puts it a bunch of hunters who don`t give really care and are in it just for the kill.
As far as sticking to-gether goes crossbows have the potencial to cut back and eliminate some bow seasons, Then we will have nothing to so called sticking to-gether for.

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Walksalot
03-16-2005, 04:16 PM
Hey Walksalot , Again with due respect I know of several rifle hunters who did poorly in regards to wounding and quit hunting.
I have always thought the better compound shots always made better traditional shots because of the reason of form and mental disapline being pounded in as you say over and over . I enjoyed my rifle hunting , then enjoyed my compound bowhunting and now enjoy traditional bowhunting. With the increasing number of crossbow hunters and the increase of harvest I feel threatened by as Willyqbc puts it a bunch of hunters who don`t give really care and are in it just for the kill.
As far as sticking to-gether goes crossbows have the potencial to cut back and eliminate some bow seasons, Then we will have nothing to so called sticking to-gether for.

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Greybark, your shooting and harvest stats are outstanding. You are obviously a good shooter and a good hunter. Would you say you were more accurate with a compound than a traditional bow?

I tried a traditional bow for a year and at the end of that year I set up a McKenzie deer at twenty yards and flung thirty arrows at it. Ten arrows were good kill shots so I deemed this totally unacceptable and sold the bow and went back to my compound.

I guess why I softened my opinion of crossbows is because the older I get the more prone to injury I seem to get so if the time ever came when I could not draw my compound back I would look at buying a crossbow.

greybark
03-16-2005, 06:36 PM
Hey Walkalot , Definetly more accurate with the compound.
My friend Marc makes the traditional bows for Chek-Mate and yet hunts with a compound , Like you he knows what his limitations are. I wish more bowhunters were capabile making the sound and logical desicions the two of you did and I admire your "give it a fair chance attitude". I fully understand the getting older thing and would not hesitate to use a crossbow under an age or medical regulation.

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Nails
03-17-2005, 12:57 AM
Well heres my point of view, I want to change peoples opinion I dispise the warm and fluffy talk about crossbows for the Archery Only hunting season. I say NO. The GOS crossbows can be used. They are a very effective as stated over and over. You can be hunting with a loaded weapon, I know some instinctive shooters are pretty quick at drawing and shooting. The average instictive shooter will have a reduce range then that of a crossbow. The compound shooter generaly needs more time to shoot. If I were a betting man the crossbow would harvest more animals. Greybark has a valid point when it comes to crossbows used in the archery only seasons. If more people were to use crossbows in the archery only season their sucess rate will increase. I believe that point has been shown. This is going to have the govt officals review the archery only season re: harvest numbers being reduced, possible shorter season( which is way to short already). I know there is not going to be a rush of people running out to buy crossbows this minute and will be hunting this fall. My perspective is to protect the archery only season I don't see the crossbow within that perspective. Crossbows are not archery tackle.
I would allow them at 3D shoots.

houndogger
03-17-2005, 06:54 AM
I hunt with a longbow and it doesn't bother me a bit that the crossbows are in our season. Mainly because archery doesn't have any seasons. I go out the hole gos with my bow and never bat an eye. But what do I know maybe I don't get out enough.:lol:

If they allowed crossbows on a 3d course I would quit going to shoots. Makes ya cringe enough when ya here those compond miss and arrows smacking trees.:wink:

willyqbc
03-17-2005, 09:56 AM
This is going to have the govt officals review the archery only season re: harvest numbers being reduced, possible shorter season( which is way to short already). I know there is not going to be a rush of people running out to buy crossbows this minute and will be hunting this fall. My perspective is to protect the archery only season I don't see the crossbow within that perspective. Unforunately that puts us into something of a catch22 situation. I understand your desire to protect the meagre archery seasons we have now. I too want to protect what we have, and even expand on them signifigantly. However, if we as archers and more importantly as hunters decide to stand against "one of our own" so to speak we are in effect providing the "divide" for those who would wish to divide and conquer us. Any push to remove a weapon that now enjoys status as a legal means of harvest is a step in the wrong direction in my opinion. And one less archer (wether you belive X-bower's are archers or not) is one less voice behind the push to improve our seasons and protect what we have now. Personally i don't think there is much of an impact from X-bows at all, they are a legal means of harvest here yet MANY, MANY more choose the compound or stick over them every year. I see no reason to believe that more generous seasons would change that. After all, most of us started into archery for hunting reasons and still chose our bows over the
X-bow, I see no reason that trend wouldn't continue.

Chris

again...another good debate...keep it rolling!:)

greybark
03-17-2005, 06:43 PM
I hunt with a longbow and it doesn't bother me a bit that the crossbows are in our season. Mainly because archery doesn't have any seasons. I go out the hole gos with my bow and never bat an eye. But what do I know maybe I don't get out enough.:lol:

If they allowed crossbows on a 3d course I would quit going to shoots. Makes ya cringe enough when ya here those compond miss and arrows smacking trees.:wink:
Hey Houndogger , Come up to a bowhunt during the GOS and try to rattle in a Whitetail buck. If you are lucky you will do more than"bat an eye" , You will find your self framed in the optics that sit on top of a 300 mag then you will have to change your pants. (I know I been framed several times). If you are unlucky I get first dibs on your dogs.:biggrin:

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Walksalot
03-17-2005, 07:58 PM
Hey Houndogger , Come up to a bowhunt during the GOS and try to rattle in a Whitetail buck. If you are lucky you will do more than"bat an eye" , You will find your self framed in the optics that sit on top of a 300 mag then you will have to change your pants. (I know I been framed several times). If you are unlucky I get first dibs on your dogs.:biggrin:

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Greybark, I must disagree. If one get off the beaten path and into the bush half a mile you leave most of the hunters behind.

greybark
03-17-2005, 08:51 PM
Hey Walksalot .In the past I have taken several steps to get away from the rifle hunters , Even to the extent of placing false treestands and fording a raging river (try this at night returning from your treestand). One time i found myself doing the breststroke when it was minus 25c , Try it -first you can`t breath then any body function is on a 5 sec delay then you can`t stand up then you crawl out onto the bank. Then follows the weirdest run/stagger for camp before you freeze solid, It only works untill the rifle boys figure that if a traditional bowhunter can get his deer in a certain spot then there must be one heck of a lot of deer there and they readily come to the call and glass with their scopes. Too many bad memories of conflict. In the Christon Valley you can run (walk) but you can`t hide!!!!

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Nails
03-18-2005, 01:38 AM
I love hunting plain and simple. I hunt with bow. I support all forms of legal hunting. I have hunted with a buddy who hunts with a crossbow. I have thought in the past that crossbows are archery tackle because I never gave it much thought. I have to say that is not the case now. I look at how they operate.
I saw a ad (some may have seen it) for a rifle that shoots bolts. It was pretty bizzar. I don't think they sold many.The two have many of the same key principles for operation aside from the gases from the cartrige that propel the bolt, the cocked limbs propel the bolt. Aiming and firing mechs are the same, both can be carried loaded. One might consider this the evolution of crossbows minus limbs.
This is a great way to pass time on the nightshift, Like I said before I would support all legal tackle.

QnsCowboy
03-18-2005, 02:25 PM
My thought is that cross bows may have an effect on the Island when it comes to LEH for Elk.....This may indeed make for greater harvests of Elk and thus limiting what we have...Rifle hunters (which I still have my rifles) who have been trying for ever to get Elk LEH on the Island, may start to throw their names in for archery only LEH's on a whim...Not exactly what I aspire an archerly only season to be... But, Chris too has a point that we have to be careful we don't cut off, who may be our best alies....Definitley a Catch 22.

Craig

houndogger
03-18-2005, 07:51 PM
Barky I am sure the wife would gladly give you the pack if I was gone.:lol:

leftcoast
03-18-2005, 10:05 PM
Well I am a firm believer that all hunters need to stick together if we want to enjoy this sport for a few more years legally. If there is going to be a special archery only season, then crossbow hunters have as much right to it as me and my long bow do. on the Island i don't like the archery season as it is because it is too dang hot at that time of year.

I hunt during rifle season and hunt in the timber as a rule. i never see anyone where i hunt and if they are good enough to see me then I ain't worried they are gonna mistake me for a deer.

There are slob hunters in every discipline as well as 'ethical' hunters. Shooting a long bow does not make one ethical.

biggest problem I see is that there are far too many guys out there trying to tell the rest of us what is ethical.

I ain't interested in a crossbow but a crossbow pistol would be fun in camp for shooting mice around the campfire at night.

Wouldn't bother me in the least if the archery only season was not there, I don't feel that I am handicapped because i use a bow. I do feel like I am hunting though, not just shooting.

=keith=

Nails
03-19-2005, 02:38 AM
In general it is good to see most people here believe along the same lines and agree to disagree. As said previously by others we need to stick together first and foremost. We stand for each others chosen legal weapon but we also need to take a stand for each others different styles of hunting ie. baiting for bears, hound hunting for cats or bears, hunting for grizzlies ect. I don't like it when hunters speak out loud with non-hunters in ear shot that this or that method is wrong. I believe the saying hunters are the first conservationist, it is true. In BC we need to remain united and shed a positive light.

I still have my opinion about crossbows. My nightshift rant.