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View Full Version : Will there be a sockeye opening on the Fraser?



BIGHUNTERFISH
07-03-2007, 08:14 AM
So whats the news on the Fraser river sockeye returns for this year?Are we going to have an opening ?I know there are some guys who are against this fishery,but I think it is alot of fun and if the run can sustain it,go at her.These are the best eating salmon in the world,and you can get your fly rods out and catch pinks till you arms fall off.I can hardly wait.:-D

browningboy
07-03-2007, 08:42 AM
I think the sockeye fishery is great but have heard rumblings of it changing, as you know most use 12 foot leaders and "floss teeth", but rumors are that leaders will be a max of 2 and a half feet.
Problem that this fishery poses is room, there are people that become very territorial etc., cast over you constantly and purposely snag into your fish and creates a bad day from good, hopefully if the new rule comes in it will eliminate 50% but I doubt it.
Excuse for boats for some!:wink:

lip_ripper00
07-03-2007, 09:14 AM
I have not herd anything about run size yet, but hearing rumblings and It dosen't sound good. I'm not sure if decreasing leader length is the answer. this might not make sense to some but, the fish are their catch your 2 fish a day and go home, if your using a 2-3 foot leader your going to be flossing with your main line you feel that bump go to set the hook and slam 3oz of lead in to the side of the fishes head I don't think hes going to make it.Higher fish mortality. Leave leader lengths alone but once you have your get off the bar and let someone else in

Mr. Dean
07-03-2007, 09:24 AM
Never liked the bar fishing. WAY to crowded for me to relax and enjoy the day.

I too have heard of the rumours of things changing but none of em confirmed as of yet.

SHAKER
07-03-2007, 09:31 AM
I love when they bring up the leader length thing. Almost as good as getting on the blow horn and yelling at guys to stop bottom bouncing!

I got told once that my leader was too long fishing for springs- well I started laughing and spilled my beer.....Not so funny anymore. Their is NO rule stating how long of leader you can use or what method you MUST fish with. This is not Russia- we do have the right to fish. As long as we follow the rules that are in place now, ie Single barbless hook, limits ect. If that aint good enough then tell'em to go "suck bo-bo, billy."

browningboy
07-03-2007, 12:24 PM
Yes the leader thing is stupid, but with fisheries, you just never know.:-? This has been a dispute for awhile for some but like others say, get your two fish and skeet! This fishery has been growing huge in the last few years, you can tell when you see some guys gear on the water, 6ft stergeon rod and a reel the size of a football then the snagging starts, they don't seem to have any fishing etiquite, consistantly cast over you....Rant..sorry but thats why I quit fishing from the popular bars, just a gongshow!
Anyhow my 3 cents.:mrgreen:

abbyfireguy
07-03-2007, 04:26 PM
Fisheries has asked many many times to use alternative methods for fishing for springs during non-sockeye opening and yet most people only know one method to fish the Fraser,bottom bouncing...
That will most probably bring in tighter regs for salmon fisheries outside the sockeye openings....Keep it up guys and you'll have regs put in to limit against bbing for springs..
Fisheries can only ask or suggest so many times then they bring in mandatory regs...
I'm out on the Fraser most of the year guiding and there are other methods that produce fish...
As far as this years run size, I am sceptical about numbers this early...
Give in a couple of more weeks and watch the test fishery sets...
Try the Pacific Salmon Commission site...

SHAKER
07-07-2007, 10:21 AM
:cry: Aaauhh......... Them fisheries boys aint happy, well too bad. Their is other ways to catch springs for sure (plunk'n spin'n glows, drift fishing, back trolling ect...) But the most perductive way I've found is to BB. Sorry if that offends anyone, but it's a whole lot more intertaining than bakeing in the sun drink'n beer and waiting for a hit. I've done my share of that and it sucks. The real reason we're out there is catch a fish to eat right? and with a limit of 1 and 10 per season? who cares. Natives doing one drift catch more than the whole bar will in a day. So leave me alone about a single line drifting in the river with a single barbless hook!:twisted:

Silent Wolf
07-07-2007, 01:02 PM
I hope they close the river down, as this style of fishing moves on to other rivers.

BBing to me is Poaching plain and simple.

15' leader and a 3oz betty cast drift drift drift rip fish on it not fishing.


OH SHE WILL BE CLOSED........................

Dirty
07-07-2007, 01:21 PM
My favourite complaint is guys who say they aren't going to buy a whole new fishing rod to bar fish it's too expensive. These are the same guys that complain about sockeye not being opened, indians netting, and damn licenses are too expensive. These people don't care about the well being of the Fraser River or the fish populations. GREED. All they care about is stuffing their fat gullets with fish. If these people stopped and realized how much money they spend on gas to and from the river and tackle they could buy salmon cheaper. I could care less if they shut the entire Fraser River down to Salmon fishing. Then there would be a reason to stop the indians and commercials from netting.

Mr. Dean
07-07-2007, 03:19 PM
Aren't the regs (supposedly) based on the assumtion of Fair Chase?

I have no experience with this flossing/BB thing, but I'm wondering if it reflects the 'spirit' of the fishery. I like my style... It's the fish that makes the decision to accept or decline my offering. It's this challenge that keeps me coming back to do it again. Thus making the 'reward' more rewarding in the end.

If all a guy wants is meat, I hear that native fish can be had for little.

Dirty
07-07-2007, 03:53 PM
[quote=Mr. Dean;164685
If all a guy wants is meat, I hear that native fish can be had for little.[/quote]

I would never, ever, in a million years buy a fish off of a native. That would just be supporting their contribution to the degradation of the salmon runs in the Fraser River Watersheds. In my opinion most of the native bands in the lower mainland have gone from keepers of the land to reapers of the land. FYI- I am part native

Steeleco
07-07-2007, 06:13 PM
I would never, ever, in a million years buy a fish off of a native. That would just be supporting their contribution to the degradation of the salmon runs in the Fraser River Watersheds. In my opinion most of the native bands in the lower mainland have gone from keepers of the land to reapers of the land. FYI- I am part native

Agreed Dirty!, I liken it to the trade in bear parts, no market no need to supply it. As fas as BB, it can be fun and it can be frustrating too. Once I've got my limit it's time to go home and enjoy one of them!

SHAKER
07-07-2007, 06:35 PM
My favourite complaint is guys who say they aren't going to buy a whole new fishing rod to bar fish it's too expensive. These are the same guys that complain about sockeye not being opened, indians netting, and damn licenses are too expensive. These people don't care about the well being of the Fraser River or the fish populations. GREED. All they care about is stuffing their fat gullets with fish. If these people stopped and realized how much money they spend on gas to and from the river and tackle they could buy salmon cheaper. I could care less if they shut the entire Fraser River down to Salmon fishing. Then there would be a reason to stop the indians and commercials from netting.

I love this...Maybe you don't care if the river is open but I'm sure allot of people do (resident anglers,Sport shops, hotels, guides, small resturants ect.). But to think that it's going to stop the other groups from fishing??? That is truley a joke! As far as legal methods??? Then shut down just about every moving piece of water salmon of all kinds travel threw. Flossing can be done with a float VERY effectivly and is practiced on many rivers. Oh he's got a float on it's O.K., thats really putting your head in the sand. I see more "snagging" on the smaller inland rivers (Vedder, Chehalis) than I ever have on the Fraser. It's the narrow minds that ruin a very sucsessful fishery for everyone.
Now I remember why I moved away from the valley! And don't miss it!:twisted:

Mr. Dean
07-07-2007, 11:26 PM
Can someone walk me through a set-up; If I wanted to floss or bounce, what would it look like?

Also, are these two terms reflecting the same style?

All I know for certain is that the regs clearly state that snagging with the intent to catch a fish is a no-no. Are these terms the 'politicly correct' phrases of describing the activity?

Silent Wolf
07-08-2007, 01:21 AM
Mr.Dean,

You want to know the set up easy..

Tie a swivel on your main line clip on a 2-3oz betty then get some 40lb leader about 15- longer in length tie on a 4/0 or bigger hook and away you go. No need for anything on your hook as the fish dont bite anyways.

I got an easier set up it is Called the Coast Salish Fly.

It is a 10/0 tribble hook with some good raps of pencil lead around it, she is tied right on the 90lbs Main line. Cast rip Rip rip....

No different then Bbing...

Oh and no ragging on me...........Native Pride runs thick in my blood.

I would say close the Fraser back down to Sockeyes in my eyes.

I like how some are ragging on the Comm boys also, hell they are trying to make a living also.. I have been there, back in the early 90's to when the Comm boys where aloud to fish more then a couple of days like it is now......


SW

SHAKER
07-08-2007, 09:08 AM
Let me correct the "rigg'ns" a little. small swivel to your main line, 6-8 inches of sturgeon leader tied to another swivel (so your weight doesn't crush your main leader) then 10-15 ft of 15-20 lb. leader, slip a corkie on to keep your hook off the bottom and finally a Max. 4\0 hook. Remember to pinch that barb boys! Cast out slightly up stream, and feel your presentation down the river. NO Yanking required untill your arm gets straitend out and starts buck'n and peel'n line with a nice slab of chrome bright salmon on the end. Hope this clears up the proper way to do it!

By the way I know you guys are just trying to make a liv'n but why should you have all the fun.

Oh one more......I'd say that over 50% of my fish are hooked on the inside of the mouth with this system. Not on the cheek!

BIGHUNTERFISH
07-08-2007, 09:53 AM
I think if there are any concerns with any sockeye runs,then they should close the river down completely to any angling or netting .In regards to bottom bouncing for sockeyes, when the runs can sustain fishing,I have no problem with this.There should be some new rules clearly written in the regs,max.leader size,hook size,and lb on main line.I also believe that when your 2 fish quota is met your fishing is done for the day.This would relieve some pressure on the bars and ensure guys are not fishing for their family members or catch and releasing.I think if we can accept this fishery as a meat fishery and play by the rules then it would be great for all intrested parties.In regards to flossing in general,it happens all the time intentionally and unintential,if you are fishing in the vedder and set your float high and are tapping bottom every second then you are actually bottom bouncing even with a very short leader,and even though it looks like the fish has bitten in reality you have flossed him.There are guys that know this and can floss very discretly and effectively,also fly fishing with a quick sink sink tip casted upstream and wait for it to drift ,how many fish are hooked at the end of the swing,the guys that are doing this know what they are doing,it all looks good because there are some fish that do bite.So if we all accept the fact that the sockeyes for the most part do not bite in the upper Fraser and treat this as a special ''fishery''then maybe we can all start to get along.

SHAKER
07-08-2007, 10:37 AM
Well said! I would love to see it in place that once your limit is achieved your done. This rule is in place for Steelhead so why wouldn't that work for Sock's, Springs or anything else. Catch and release is "apperently" the cause of most the mortality and this would definatly slow that down. The other fact is, that their would be more room on the bars for the easier access spots and everyone could partisiapate and have some fun, not just the guys who got in their at first light and stay all day.

Fly fishing? Definatly the way allot of salmon are hooked on fly gear in faster moving water and boy it looks good when you do it. Them guys "chuck'n guts" cant believe your into anther fish on your very next cast.

I'm with you, let all just try and get along!:wink:
Lifes to short to worry about BS stuff.

lip_ripper00
07-08-2007, 11:26 AM
Well said! I would love to see it in place that once your limit is achieved your done. This rule is in place for Steelhead so why wouldn't that work for Sock's, Springs or anything else. Catch and release is "apperently" the cause of most the mortality and this would definatly slow that down. The other fact is, that their would be more room on the bars for the easier access spots and everyone could partisiapate and have some fun, not just the guys who got in their at first light and stay all day.

I'm with you, let all just try and get along!:wink:
Lifes to short to worry about BS stuff.

good points but you have to do something about people who catch their 2 sockeye and spend the rest of the day hooking and releasing sockeye, trying to catch a spring.

newhunterette
07-08-2007, 12:12 PM
I just came through the Fraser canyon coming home from my hideaway and the rivers were wall to wall native nets taking springs - it is sad to see all the fishing disappearing for everyone - a legacy all Canadians should be able to enjoy and when I say all Canadians I mean all multicultural Canadians who are legal here through the proper channels - trying to stay as politically correct as she can be - hoping I did not offend anyone in my comments - just my opinion

Steeleco
07-08-2007, 12:19 PM
Can someone walk me through a set-up; If I wanted to floss or bounce, what would it look like?

Also, are these two terms reflecting the same style?

All I know for certain is that the regs clearly state that snagging with the intent to catch a fish is a no-no. Are these terms the 'politicly correct' phrases of describing the activity?


Let me know when your free, I'll put on the coffee. :wink: It's a lot of fun fishing this way IMHO, but the dingbats do spoils things.

It's good thing it's not popular with all people, or there would be no room on the river!

Mr. Dean
07-09-2007, 01:33 AM
...I'd say that over 50% of my fish are hooked on the inside of the mouth with this system. Not on the cheek!

And I'd have to say that over 99% (easily) of my catch, the fish actively searched out/hunted/chased/stalked my bait, then made a decision (entirely based on the presentation of...) as to whether or not to attack it.

All I'm doing here is 'just comparing notes'. But (so far) I'm failing to see little (if any?) fair chase ideology with this type of catch… I find myself asking; Where’s the sport?


I do think that I learned something here – I think that I now understand why I have a hard time convincing local river fisherman buddy’s, into coming out and splitting the fuel costs of a day’s fishing on the BIG water. In a Flosser’s eyes, I must be WHACKED out of my gourd for the willingness to part w/ a 100-dollar bill, not to mention all the other costs associated with the ownership of a boat!

Not here to pass judgment; I’ll leave that to the powers that be. I’m mature enough to agree to disagree and to leave it at that. Everyone has to draw his or her own line in the sand. If the Rule-makers/enforcers say it’s good, then it’s fine w/ me.

But I wouldn’t be surprised if BIG changes came down the pipe in an effort to curtail this endeavor. I just hope that the changes (if any) don’t affect my practices. If so, I’ll be PI$$ED!

Then again, I don’t really care for the bar fish’n anyway…





Steeleco;
Better get that pot-a-brewin’. I want my lesson!

Maybe I'm missing something (?). :confused:

Elkhound
07-09-2007, 10:09 AM
In a Flosser’s eyes, I must be WHACKED out of my gourd for the willingness to part w/ a 100-dollar bill, not to mention all the other costs associated with the ownership of a boat!



Ahhhhh, but it is a great day on the water and the price of fuel is worth the enjoyment as you know. We should pick a day Mr.Dean......have you pick up David......and throw your boat in the water in Horseshoe Bay. You can zip over here in less than 30min. Tie up the boat a couple hundred yards from my place.....lets go fishing for the day, throw in the crab traps too, with a nice BBQ after. Thats what life is all about eh.....stuff like that. Invite for the two of you is open.

Dave

SHAKER
07-09-2007, 10:36 AM
[quote=Mr. Dean;165073]And I'd have to say that over 99% (easily) of my catch, the fish actively searched out/hunted/chased/stalked my bait, then made a decision (entirely based on the presentation of...) as to whether or not to attack it.


If your salmon fishing in any sort of non-stationary mannor in a river, how do you really know this? unless your chuck'n spinners or spoons in some slack water area.

Like Bigfishhunter said, it can be done very discreatly! or unintentionaly with just about any type of tackle including fly gear!

The basic principals of fly fishing in a river are exactly the same as BB with gear. "Sweep Search"

I believe that we shouldn't beat on each other about our ways, we are all outdoorsmen and need to stick together or we will end up with nothing!

Steeleco
07-09-2007, 10:44 AM
Well said Shaker. I took a course given by the late Ted Peck on how to fish sockeye in the Fraser. That was some time ago and it was never done much before that.

For me if you stay within your limit, follow the rules and have fun, great. For years the "road hunting" debate as been quite the topic too, what ever puts a smile on your face.

Mr. Dean
07-09-2007, 02:16 PM
I'm NOT a river fisher... I'm NOT beating/slammin anyone... I'm just trying to grasp this.

From what I've seen here, this fishing is an effort of impaling the fish w/ a hook (snagging) rather than enticing a fish to bite. IF my thinking is clear (and I'm not sure that it is) then it IS infact an illeagal form of catching a Salmon (or any other type of fish) in any body of water.

The regulations are crystal clear about it.

The Fishery Police don't hastle guy's doin this??? Somethings not adding up.

bighornbob
07-09-2007, 03:22 PM
Mr. Dean

With a 15 foot leader your leader actually is the part that gets caught in the open mouth of the fish and when you reel in or the fish swims forward it brings the hook up to the mouth, snagging the fish in mouth. I think the cops dont do much because they would have to prove the fish did not bite the hook (some guys tie red wool onto the hook). I have heard that some guys have been fined if the cops see them keep a fish that was snagged in the belly or back, becuase they can prove that the fish was snagged and not actually bitten at the hook.

Its a fine line and everybody know that the sockeye dont feed once in the river but its what the fish cops can prove in court.

BHB

greybark
07-09-2007, 03:38 PM
8)Hey Mr Dean , In my opinion this is not a "Recreactional Fishery " as such but can be described as a "Harvest Fishery" . Sockeye don`t bite in the Fraser and The Fishery Boys allow this form of flossing . This form of "fishing" is certainly in the grey area and pushes the legality aspect . Over all I feel the Feds have made the right move allowing this form of fishing . I have not noticed the aledged floss over to other rivers . To those who are against flossing of Sockeye , No proplem do with out .
8)I think flossing should be limited to the Sockeye fishery and when limited out go home .
:wink:Sorry for the hijack.

REMEMBER -- Keep Your Fingertab On --

Mr. Dean
07-09-2007, 03:43 PM
I have concluded that this is WAY to complicated for me. Think I'll just stick to tossing out/sinking a herring.

I like to keep it simple.

Mr. Dean
07-09-2007, 03:54 PM
Ahhhhh, but it is a great day on the water and the price of fuel is worth the enjoyment as you know. We should pick a day Mr.Dean......have you pick up David......and throw your boat in the water in Horseshoe Bay. You can zip over here in less than 30min. Tie up the boat a couple hundred yards from my place.....lets go fishing for the day, throw in the crab traps too, with a nice BBQ after. Thats what life is all about eh.....stuff like that. Invite for the two of you is open.

Dave

Sounds like a BIG day.

Horseshoe Bay is a joke! I perfer the planetarium. :wink: I'll formulate some kind of a plan then send ya a PM.

Thanks!

How 'bout throwing me a phone# ?

lip_ripper00
07-09-2007, 03:55 PM
[quote=greybark;165218]8)Hey Mr Dean , In my opinion this is not a "Recreactional Fishery " as such but can be described as a "Harvest Fishery" . Sockeye don`t bite in the Fraser and The Fishery Boys allow this form of flossing . This form of "fishing" is certainly in the grey area and pushes the legality aspect . Over all I feel the Feds have made the right move allowing this form of fishing . I have not noticed the aledged floss over to other rivers . To those who are against flossing of Sockeye , No proplem do with out .
8)I think flossing should be limited to the Sockeye fishery and when limited out go home .
:wink:Sorry for the hijack.

exactly, if you want fresh sockeye snag your 2 fish and go home. If I was allowed to use a dip net to take my 2 fish a day i would but I can't:-D